***Andrew Kramer***

[Howard Brown]

Casebook's Press Reports section has this story in their archives here :

http://www.casebook.org/press_reports/decatur_review/271226.html

This is the article as it appeared in that Decatur newspaper :

http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Photo%20Thanksgiving/Forums%20March%202010/June%202010/ak-1.jpg

We now have a photo of the individual in question from the....

Heraldo de Mexico
December 24, 1927
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http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Photo%20Thanksgiving/Forums%20March%202010/June%202010/ak2.jpg
http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Photo%20Thanksgiving/Forums%20March%202010/June%202010/ak3.jpg
http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Photo%20Thanksgiving/Forums%20March%202010/June%202010/ak4.jpg
http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Photo%20Thanksgiving/Forums%20March%202010/June%202010/ak5.jpg

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Above all, I am interested in the statement from handwriting expert & criminologist, Milton Carlson, who stated matter of factly that the Whitechapel Murderer's name was Andrew Kramer.

There is one possible discrepancy,however, with the Mexican newspaper...and it is in regard to how Cramer/Kramer spelled his surname. The Illinois newspaper spelled it "Cramer", while the Mexican paper spells it "Kramer".

This might be a nice project for someone to undertake....locating Milton Carlson and see where or how he came to the conclusion that the Ripper's name was Andrew Kramer.

[Howard Brown]

One extra bit of information comes from a paper of roughly the same date

This article is also found transcribed on Casebook.

Havre (Montana) Daily News Promoter
December 26, 1927
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http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Photo%20Thanksgiving/Forums%20March%202010/June%202010/ak6.jpg

[Howard Brown]

One more from the

Springfield (Mass) Republican
December 27,1927
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http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Photo%20Thanksgiving/Forums%20March%202010/June%202010/ak7.jpghttp://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Photo%20Thanksgiving/Forums%20March%202010/June%202010/ak8.jpg

[Howard Brown]

Lowell (Mass) Sun
December 20,1919
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http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Photo%20Thanksgiving/Forums%20March%202010/June%202010/mc1-1.jpg
http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Photo%20Thanksgiving/Forums%20March%202010/June%202010/mc3-1.jpg


http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Photo%20Thanksgiving/Forums%20March%202010/June%202010/mc2-1.jpg
http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Photo%20Thanksgiving/Forums%20March%202010/June%202010/mc4-1.jpg

[Howard Brown]

The man was not only respected,but involved with a famous case in the 1920's as shown here....so its surprising that he came up with this name "Andrew Kramer" and it hasn't been checked into.

Oxnard( Cal ) Courier
October 19,1926
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http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Photo%20Thanksgiving/Forums%20March%202010/June%202010/mcx.jpg

[Howard Brown]

One more photo from the Salt Lake Tribune, March 22,1929

http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Photo%20Thanksgiving/Forums%20March%202010/June%202010/mcz.jpg

[Howard Brown]

Since the initials are the same, is it possible this handwriting expert confused "Aaron Kosminski" with "Andrew Kramer" ?
Yet...how could he have known of Kosminski ?

Another link...from Popular Mechanics in 1925
http://books.google.com/books?id=49oDAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA353&dq=%22Milton+Carlson%22&hl=en&ei=OlhLTK3RL8L-8AaZgskz&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=book-thumbnail&resnum=1&ved=0CC4Q6wEwAA#v=onepage&q=%22Milton%20Carlson%22&f=false

[Howard Brown]

From the Kalamazoo (Michigan) Gazette, July 2,1922

http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Photo%20Thanksgiving/Forums%20March%202010/June%202010/add.jpg

[Nemo]

Excellent stuff Howard

Edgar Rice Burroughs appears to have had an interest in the case

It was a very gruesome murder in that he had already dismembered the body before he re-assembled it in order to collect ransom money, and drove with the body propped up beside himself in a car, with the eyes held open with wire!

http://www.erbzine.com/mag17/1767.html

http://www.erbzine.com/mag17/1766.html

7947

7948

7949

I haven't heard of Kramer, though he could have been a contemporary discounted suspect

It states that he was charged with the WM

I wonder why they mistakenly used 1881 as the date of the WM, perhaps Kramer is associated with 1881 in some way

[Howard Brown]

Nemo:

Not only was Carlson chosen to handle the McPherson scandal ( It was big news in its time ) but he was called in to work for Fatty Arbuckle's defense....which was the biggest scandal to hit Hollywood...at the time...and maybe even to this date.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatty_Arbuckle
New Orleans Item
January 26,1922
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http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Photo%20Thanksgiving/Forums%20March%202010/June%202010/fatty.jpg

Personally, I can understand the issue with the dates...1881 instead of 1888...but for him to use that name or any name as if it was common knowledge.... Carlson wasn't taking the name Kramer or the WM Case to enhance the 1926 case....but casually mentioning it as if it was accepted as fact in my view. Thats what is so puzzling. That he had a name to drop that we haven't heard of.

[Nemo]

Has this some connection?

The date of 1927 seems a little too coincidental...

http://huntnews.net/letter/H_part122.html#33

HICKMAN, WILLIAM EDWARD
GREENVILLE MESSENGER, THU, 29 DEC 1927, : 1ANDREW KRAMER IN JAIL, NOT GUILTY (LOS ANGELES)

[Howard Brown]

Sounds like it,Nemo.

[Nemo]

Just wondering where the "Not Guilty" bit came from...

[Nemo]

The "Not Guilty" appears to either be a question, asking if Hickman was innocent or not, or it applies to a real person who was in prison at the time according to the following from Wikipaedia...

On December 19, Parker delivered the ransom in Los Angeles but in return Hickman delivered the girl's dismembered body. Her arms and legs had been severed and her internal organs removed. A towel stuffed into her body to absorb blood led police to Hickman's apartment building, but he managed to escape. A $100,000 reward was offered for his capture, and for nearly a week Hickman eluded capture.

He was finally caught after spending some of the ransom in Washington and Oregon. He subsequently confessed to kidnapping Marion, but blamed her murder on a man who was actually in jail during the time of the crime. He was extradited back to Los Angeles where he confessed to another murder he committed during a drug store hold-up as well as many other armed robberies

So I assume that the connection made by Carlson may be in error

As you say Howard, the important point is why would he think that a drowned suspect for the Whitechapel murders is named Kramer?

[Howard Brown]

Bump Up

[Howard Brown]

This article contains a little bit more info behind Hickman's use of the alias Andrew Cramer...

http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Forums%202012/hav1.jpg

http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Forums%202012/hav7.jpg

http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Forums%202012/hav2.jpg
http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Forums%202012/hav3.jpg
http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Forums%202012/hav4.jpg



http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Forums%202012/hav5.jpg
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