Compared To The Ripper : Discussion

[How Brown]

Here's an article with a story about a real ladies man...Mr. Flowers and Candy on Valentine's Day.

The day after the Chapman murder, this story appeared featuring the further exploits of one local caballero named F. Kersey....notable for the nearly 2 dozen instances of assult or charges worthy of appearing in court....excuse me, convicted 22 times.

Question for Forums members :

Is this man in any way the sort of character capable of committing the Whitechapel Murders ?

If so, please explain.
If possible,please give your reasons why....
If not, likewise...please elaborate.

The reason why I ask this is not to put anyone on the proverbial spot with an answer that everyone else will quickly criticize....but Kersey doesn't seem to be a man ( judging him based only on this one report....he might get the once over twice later on when I check the Old Bailey records...) who could premeditate murder...but rather committed violence spontaneously. I wonder if ANY of these 23 charges involved a man.

Then again, do you feel the WM were premeditated or random acts of spontaneous madness. ?

Lloyd's Weekly
September 9, 1888
***************


http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Photo%20Thanksgiving/Forums%20March%202010/June%202010/fk.jpg

[How Brown]

I found this case in the Old Bailey...

Prepare yourself for a surprise....just kidding...it wasn't a crime against property,just a person.

15 months hard labor for Frank Kersey.

I didn't see any other references to him by that name. Neither did I find mention of the other convictions mentioned in the Lloyd's article.

http://www.oldbaileyonline.org/browse.jsp?id=def1-884-18880917&div=t18880917-884#highlight

[Cris Malone]

If someone with this chap's record had committed the WM he would have been caught. He couldn't keep his cool and appeared to be more dangerous to people he knew.

The Ripper was, no doubt violent, but had to have been able to plan and disguise his intentions until he felt the time was right. Mr. Kersey seemed to quickly come unhinged at any perceived infraction at any moment.

Having said that, there certainly is no pre-cast die for a serial killer to fit into. Some have had a history of abuse... Now, if Mr. Kersey had committed arson as well... which reminds me... How did those dock fires get started on the night of the Nichols murder?
Sorry for the boring question.

P.S.- Ain't it funny how the woman's head just came into contact with inanimate objects... at least that was Mr. Kersey's defense. She was very clumsy.

[Nemo]

Sounds like an average domestic to me, considering some wives were kicked to death openly in the street at the time


No wife-beater I've ever come across had the courage to attack others outside the home, unless they were on steroids

I don't think there is any major objection to this guy or a similar one being responsible for murder at some time though

[How Brown]

No wife-beater I've ever come across had the courage to attack others outside the home, unless they were on steroids---Nemo

Exactly my impression of the matter,Neems....I have tried to find an example of a serial killer who only beat the hell out of his wife on a regular basis or other women...and I came up short. In fact, something diametrically opposite seems to be true in s.k. cases...that serial killers will not take it out on the family,preferring strangers. Not that all serial killers abstained from domestic violence, but it appears for the most part that they garnered little notoriety from such aberrant behavior.

Domestic wife abusers,cowards that they are,are usually found avoiding male-male confrontations as you intimated..

[Nemo]

A lot of serial killers seem to be quite mild at home, within their normal life, among friends etc

They seem to relish the secrecy and anonymity of the crime which allows them to vent their emotions

Appearing to be a normal and social person seems quite important to them whereas their crimes might be noted for their inhumanity, cruelty, brutality and wantonness

[How Brown]

Nemo:

Lets me and you try to find one serial killer who smacked his wife & kids around...I'm telling you that its going to be an effort.
Fish was known for his parenting and the way he raised a handful of kids on his own...
Most wives of these monsters, such as Ridgeway's and Baumeister's, were professed to be just as stunned that their husbands were capable of the nearly 80 murders between them that were committed as the community at large.
Then again, the whole argument of what a wife or significant family member knows or subconsciously avoids about a husband who is a sk, for whatever reason that may be, surfaces.

[Nemo]

I've heard of a few getting rough in the bedroom, bondage and simulated rape and the like, though that's not quite the same as wife-beating...

[Nemo]

Richard Kuklinski abused his wife and kids for a period but I would certainly put him in a different class to most other serial killers

[Cris Malone]

Not to be boring, but I recall one that would fit the bill...Edmund Kemper. He shot his grandparents while in his teens. When asked why he did it, he replied, "I just wondered how it would feel to shoot Grandma". He was released after 9 years of psychiatric treatment. He left the examining board meeting with the head of a 15 year-old victim in the trunk of his car. He had already killed 2 others a few months before.

He loved to have sex with the intestines and severed heads of his victims. He would eat the flesh in a macaroni casserole.

His finale act was to kill his mother. Psychiatrists said she was the object of his rage all along. Reckon these were the same psychiatrists that earlier declared Kemper 'cured'. Anyway, he smashed her skull, cut her throat, cut off her head and raped her corpse; then, propped her head up on the mantle and used it as a dart board. When he tried to shove her larynx down the garbage disposal, it spat back out into his face. He later told police, "That seemed appropriate; as much as she'd bitched and screamed and yelled at me over so many years."

Afterwards, he called her best friend over for dinner, strangled her, took her body to bed and had sex with it the rest of the night.

He later turned himself in (the police didn't believe him at first because many on the force knew him). At his trial, when the judge asked him what he thought his punishment should be, he answered, "Death by torture".... but all of this happened in La La land (The People's Republic of California)... so he got a free room and board for life.

And folks wonder why I'm down on all of the psycho-analysts of JTR!
If there ever became a serial killer that went after parole board members, this stuff might not occur so often.

I have more examples... but will save them for a later time. Its getting late in the evening and the insects will be playing Kamakaze in the bug zapper pretty soon... Hell, its too hot to fish and no need to mow the grass 'cause its dying right now...I think 'Psycho' is on TV tonight.

[Nemo]

Angelo Buono, one of the Hillside stranglers was a wife beater, but again this duo were not your average/normal (can those words be used in this context) serial killers

In connection with the Hillside stranglers, I came across an interesting angle involving a modern serial rapist and killer called Sharif Sharif who was locked up in Mexico

He reportedly offered money to anyone who would kill in his style to prove to the authorities that he was not the killer. Many people took him up on his offer and created numerous additional victims

Kenneth Bianchi, the other Hillside strangler attempted the same. While incarcerated, he encouraged a female admirer to strangle a victim to make it look like the Hillside strangler was still on the loose, which she attempted

It made me wonder if the Ripper was actually locked up for the Ripper crimes during October/November 1888 and who had an accomplice who was prepared to kill in the "Whitechapel manner" in order to obtain the freedom of his friend

It would account for any anomalies in the method of the Kelly killing, and give reasons for the Ripper to have disappeared after this killing (sorry -I should probably have started a new thread with that speculation)

An abuser of his children was Fred West, though again, the abuse appears to be sexual rather than straight beating

Peter Tobin is a good candidate for wife beating, I seem to recall an interview with one of his old girlfriends who stated he was violent

I would have expected BTK to have been a wife beater but I'm not sure about that - I'll look into it

[How Brown]

Kenneth Bianchi, the other Hillside strangler attempted the same. While incarcerated, he encouraged a female admirer to strangle a victim to make it look like the Hillside strangler was still on the loose, which she attempted

Slight correction,honorable Nemo...the psycho lady who tried to strangle some young lady needed no encouragement from Bianchi, She did that voluntarily.

In any event, thats a nice list you and the ever boring C.Malone added.

Thanks buddy.

Anyone else have something to add ?