I have crossed the Rubicon

[Jeff Leahy]

I think we are now in a situation where new ideas and information must be released if we are to answer the rediculous claims put foreward by Trevor Marriot that now dominate the Ripper media?

I have crossed the Rubicon

Jeff Leahy
Producer/director

PD Rubicon..'not good with spelling'

[Donald Souden]

Jeff,

Iacta alea est , the die has been cast, eh Caesar?

Don.

[How Brown]

http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Autumn%202011/rubicon.jpg

[String]

Veni, Vidi, Vici

[Tom_Wescott]

Yo quiero Taco Bell.

[admin tim]

Nunc Est Bibendum has always done it for Howard.

[How Brown]

In Hock Signo Davinci

[Chris G.]

http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/ac287/HowieNina/Autumn%202011/rubicon.jpg

Caesar is now Salad!

[George Hutchinson]

Jeff - it's all very well your suggesting you've crossed the Rubicon, but there's no evidence you were anywhere near it after the 1870s.

PHILIP

[Jeff Leahy]

No, but it is a great expression, remind me to use it more often in conversation...

Hopefully I will make myself a little clearer at this years conference...until than I have some new virtual stuff to complete

Yours Jeff

[George Lorton]

Was the grass greener on the other side of the Rubicon? I think Rubicon is or was a show on AMC. I used to watch it after Mad Men. So I guessed while I have not crossed the Rubicon I have watched it.:yo:

[Jeff Leahy]

No I think that a whole year of being part of a public 'FACE'

Was what I was getting at.....

John Bennet and Paul Begg and I made a program together and for many reasons we had to have a united face..

And while I cant think of two people who i revire , admir and Love

more than John and Paul

as a team, on the final fifteen minutes of that program....well we clearly had diffences...:peep:

I'm not quite certain why everyone thinks we should have agreed?

And actually by and large I think they both talk more sense than anyone else I know on the subject...

But I do now feel FREE to say I believe Aaron Kosminski was Jack the Ripper, while recognising that I cant prove that statement, or that anyone else working on the projecct could think otherwise...?

FREE! to cross the rubicon after all this time and speak for myself rather than a team...

I wish them all luck...

But Aaron is the only logical JtR candiate given what is known at present about the JtR mystery

Yours Jeff

[George Lorton]

Hi Jeff

I need to use Rubicon more as do the folks around me. Seriously I never heard that expression until you made your post and to me the word was just the name of a show on AMC. Now I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed given that after High School I just have some Tech school under my belt but I am well read. I've just always said, "I have crossed the point of no return." when using that type of expression or saying "I can't turn back now," I like "I have crossed the Rubicon", better!

The origins of the term had to do with a river in Italy which was considered the point of no return or the edge of the then known world in Roman times or more to the point, Julius Caesar's Day. When Caesar crossed it to conquer/explore everything in his path he crossed the point of no return for him. Some scholar must of made that point in his/her work or study on Caesar.

Regarding Jack The Ripper, well he (or she) crossed it when he murdered his first victim, whoever that was. I'm thinking it was probably some poor animal which he might of killed in childhood for cheap thrills.:playball:

[Jeff Leahy]

Hi Jeff

I need to use Rubicon more as do the folks around me. Seriously I never heard that expression until you made your post and to me the word was just the name of a show on AMC. Now I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed given that after High School I just have some Tech school under my belt but I am well read. I've just always said, "I have crossed the point of no return." when using that type of expression or saying "I can't turn back now," I like "I have crossed the Rubicon", better!

The origins of the term had to do with a river in Italy which was considered the point of no return or the edge of the then known world in Roman times or more to the point, Julius Caesar's Day. When Caesar crossed it to conquer/explore everything in his path he crossed the point of no return for him. Some scholar must of made that point in his/her work or study on Caesar.

Regarding Jack The Ripper, well he (or she) crossed it when he murdered his first victim, whoever that was. I'm thinking it was probably some poor animal which he might of killed in childhood for cheap thrills.:playball:

Hi George

Yep I love this expression also.....it has power and meaning...

I dont think it relates to Jack the Ripper.....I dont think he ever had a choice, as its my opinion he suffered a terrible depilitating illness calling schizophrenia.....which destroyed his mind...

That said I've had an exciting weekend crossing the 'Rubicon' filming steam trains and talking to exciting people who love and work with these fantastic mechines......May my next project be this amazing experience?

But I'm on a journey, I've crossed the rubicon and there is no way back but death now.....

So if you know where I can find 30m to film the Biography of Prince Rupert please let me know....

Until such a time I think I will have to follow Julius Cesus state of mind and presence....:eyebrows:

Yours Jeff

[Jeff Leahy]

test post

[Jeff Leahy]

Sorry I have uploaded the wrong image and now seem unable to delete it

That is nature of stuff on desk top Sorry

Jeff

[Jeff Leahy]

second attempt

[George Lorton]

Hi George

Yep I love this expression also.....it has power and meaning...

I dont think it relates to Jack the Ripper.....I dont think he ever had a choice, as its my opinion he suffered a terrible depilitating illness calling schizophrenia.....which destroyed his mind...

That said I've had an exciting weekend crossing the 'Rubicon' filming steam trains and talking to exciting people who love and work with these fantastic mechines......May my next project be this amazing experience?

But I'm on a journey, I've crossed the rubicon and there is no way back but death now.....

So if you know where I can find 30m to film the Biography of Prince Rupert please let me know....

Until such a time I think I will have to follow Julius Cesus state of mind and presence....:eyebrows:

Yours Jeff


Congratulations on starting your project! You have indeed crossed the Rubicon. I hope everything goes off with out a hitch for you. Bon Chance, Jeff.

Prince Rupert? Do you mean Prince Rupert who tried to re-capture Liverpool from Parliamentary forces in the 17th centry English Civil War. he the only one that comes to mind for me.

[George Lorton]

Also thanks for sharing the pictures.

[Jeff Leahy]

Also thanks for sharing the pictures.

Thats cool...

I do apologise to everyone about the chapman image this was a complete error in loading pictures on my part. If it could be removed I'd be garateful as teh last thing i would wish to do is upset Neal or the Chapman family.

I dont know how this happened must have clicked on the wrong jpeg :jaw:

Yours Jeff

[George Lorton]

No Worries Jeff, these things happen; the wonder of techonigy. I didn't know who I was looking at. I knew it was one of the victims of this Ripper in happier time with her Husband but the name escaped me. Hopefully I was the only one who saw the picture or part of it. A corner of it to be percise.

[Jeff Leahy]

I hope Neal wont be to cross...

It was very kind of him to gain permission for its use in Definitive Story and we had much fun recreating the scene..

I gather i'm currently being discussed on casebook...I think Oscar Wilde said something about the only thing than being talked about etc...

It was great to see the program have an extra play last night and some excellent feed back about the program..

I'm aware that there is some critisism of the CGi...

Well I hope to address this at conference next week but it has been updated and should address these critisism for the DVD..

Yours Jeff

[String]

On the whole the cgi was fine. It was just a few scenes that jolted and looked too false. I'm sure if you review them you could maybe do them another way or do without them.
People have gotten very demanding in this area. In fact I was watching that new dinosaurs programme on BBC in HD and thought the cgi wasn't up to par on quite a few scenes it looked very soft.
It's easy being a critic.

[Jeff Leahy]

On the whole the cgi was fine. It was just a few scenes that jolted and looked too false. I'm sure if you review them you could maybe do them another way or do without them.
People have gotten very demanding in this area. In fact I was watching that new dinosaurs programme on BBC in HD and thought the cgi wasn't up to par on quite a few scenes it looked very soft.
It's easy being a critic.

We made the program in six months! We all worked 24/7.

The CGi has now been re-done. 24 new models. New Graphics. New Comps.

So hopefully something new for conference next week...

I'm sitting remixing the sound as we speak

Yours Jeff

PS Trevor...I have asked you consistently to debate me on the identity of Jack the Ripper. It is you that have refused to debate me and hide behind skirts..

[George Lorton]

Jeff is your program going to be shown in America anytime soon, and if so on what channel?

[Jeff Leahy]

Jeff is your program going to be shown in America anytime soon, and if so on what channel?

I'll see if I can find some play dates but the program is currently on cinematic release in the USA (mid-version)

It is playing at Halloween based film festivals, I will try and keep everyone posted

Yours Jeff

[Jeff Leahy]

I have now damaged two screen monitors reading Phil Carters posts

Who is this man ?

Never has there ever been more need for someone finally to stand and give the public the final answer to the identity of Jack the Ripper...

I understand that many of you have residence to do so..

But it must seem obvious by now there is only one real contender for the 'Mantle' or 'Mantels' of JtR?

Someone needs to point out the obvious at last...Anderson was RIGHT

Yours Jeff

[How Brown]

Jeff:

Simmer down amigo.

[Jeff Leahy]

Jeff:

Simmer down amigo.

Sorry Howard but I feel it a very sad state of affairs that the case for Aron Kosminski being Jack the Ripper has been totally hi-jacked by people who clearly dont think he was...

What we currently have is completely unbalanced argument, simply based around what was stated by Anderson and Swanson.

This has NOTHING to do with the case for Aaron actually being the Ripper.

It is VERY sad because the general public are simply faced with negative arguments being put forward by people who beleive someone other than Aron Kosminski was the Ripper..

It is therefore a sad unbalanced debate that actually deals with none of the issues..

If thats the debate the Ripper community wants and deserves....

well its up to them....but please don't expect me to support it..

Its time that debate was opened up and bought into the open and not concealed behind closed doors and those that would prefer that debate didnt happen in public (ie National public)..by those with some knowledge and belief in those arguments.

I will of course address this at this years conference

Are you trying to claim Anderson made a mistake? and how would you justify that argument?

YOurs Jeff Leahy

PS "Here we go again"??....yes the world is a sphere floating in space and orbiting the sun...It doesnt matter what sort of ....argument is made for the world being flat..it remains round Trevor.

[Scott Nelson]

Take it easy Jeff. Phil Cater is a very smart man. I don't agree with his historical approach, but he provides a lot of valuable insight into the case. Please consider using him as a consultant in your next motion picture production.

[Jeff Leahy]

I dont think I was arguing anyone wasnt smart..

Just that there is a very poor defence being made of Aaron Kosminski as the Ripper. And that those attacking the subject appear to be missing some rather obvious facts..

Firstly I see no reason why some may seem surprised that Aarons Asylum records show a man who doesnt obviously appear violent?

Schizophrenics are not dangerous. And yet this missunderstanding of this illness is constantly dragged up.....

Yet when we look at schizophrenic serial killers there is no evidence I can see that suggests that once removed from the environment they work in that they are dangerous? Does Peter Sutcliff have a record for attacking guards or inmates? No he's completely harmless as Aaron appears to have been because Schizophrenics are NOT dangerous.

What is interesting is Aarons age and known illness fit with a possible 1888 psychotic cycle. The length of the Autumn of terror matching the time an early 'psychotic episode might have taken place.

It explains the 18 week killing spree, as for very small periods schizophrenics can become very dangerous in certain circumstance...'psychotic episodes'.

ANd then we get the Lawende repeat as we always do from he Anti Aaron brigade....

So lets just quash this...Lawende wasnt the witness he makes no sense what so ever and does fit the known facts relating to the identification.

What does make sense is post PK565....'the kosminski family had 'blue eyes' they thus fitted the description given by Schwartz to Swanson..

Swanson, a credible life long policeman would have known a) what Aaron looked like and b) Schwartz desciption.

So why would he have bought in Lawende? are we suggesting he didnt know his job?

Finally it also seems a given that Schwartz witnessed Strides murder. The answer is simply if he didnt...then why didnt Fanny Mortimer, stood in her doorway following schwartz suggested timing, why didnt she see Stride if she were still alive a soliciting? and why also did Goldstein not see her?

Answer, which seems so obvious to me, is simply that she was, as Blackwells timings suggest, already dead.

Of course we can then take the list on....The crawford letter etc etc but I'm in a dash and out all day..

But I think it very unfortunate that those who seem so keen to critisis Aaron as a ripper suspect dont seem so keen to do so in public.

I welcome any such debate or chance because as a potencial suspect Aaron Kosminski by far is the strongest we have. But I guess thats why people spend so much time trying to discredit those who believe so..

Must dash

Jeff

[Paul]

I dont think I was arguing anyone wasnt smart..

Just that there is a very poor defence being made of Aaron Kosminski as the Ripper. And that those attacking the subject appear to be missing some rather obvious facts..

Firstly I see no reason why some may seem surprised that Aarons Asylum records show a man who doesnt obviously appear violent?

Schizophrenics are not dangerous. And yet this missunderstanding of this illness is constantly dragged up.....

Yet when we look at schizophrenic serial killers there is no evidence I can see that suggests that once removed from the environment they work in that they are dangerous? Does Peter Sutcliff have a record for attacking guards or inmates? No he's completely harmless as Aaron appears to have been because Schizophrenics are NOT dangerous.

What is interesting is Aarons age and known illness fit with a possible 1888 psychotic cycle. The length of the Autumn of terror matching the time an early 'psychotic episode might have taken place.

It explains the 18 week killing spree, as for very small periods schizophrenics can become very dangerous in certain circumstance...'psychotic episodes'.

ANd then we get the Lawende repeat as we always do from he Anti Aaron brigade....

So lets just quash this...Lawende wasnt the witness he makes no sense what so ever and does fit the known facts relating to the identification.

What does make sense is post PK565....'the kosminski family had 'blue eyes' they thus fitted the description given by Schwartz to Swanson..

Swanson, a credible life long policeman would have known a) what Aaron looked like and b) Schwartz desciption.

So why would he have bought in Lawende? are we suggesting he didnt know his job?

Finally it also seems a given that Schwartz witnessed Strides murder. The answer is simply if he didnt...then why didnt Fanny Mortimer, stood in her doorway following schwartz suggested timing, why didnt she see Stride if she were still alive a soliciting? and why also did Goldstein not see her?

Answer, which seems so obvious to me, is simply that she was, as Blackwells timings suggest, already dead.

Of course we can then take the list on....The crawford letter etc etc but I'm in a dash and out all day..

But I think it very unfortunate that those who seem so keen to critisis Aaron as a ripper suspect dont seem so keen to do so in public.

I welcome any such debate or chance because as a potencial suspect Aaron Kosminski by far is the strongest we have. But I guess thats why people spend so much time trying to discredit those who believe so..

Must dash

Jeff

It would be interesting to see Phil Carter debate those points with you, although his argument seems to be that the sources don't constitute evidence against Kosminski et al, so arguments such as whether or not Schwartz witnessed the prelude to Stride's murder or the meaning of the Crawford letter is irrelevant to what he is saying. As for Trevor, he isn't actually saying anything, and, insofar as not having read Martin's book or knowing anything about his thinking or his theory indicates anything, he's probably none too certain what the arguments for any of the police suspects actually are. For the most part people just get a series of trite and meaningless statements about ships sinking, clocks ticking, and book burnings on the village green, and forthcoming evidence that'll kick all previous thinking into a cocked hat. That would delight me, as some major new discovery would be very welcome, but I can't help but wonder why he doesn't just present it and stop threatening it. So no good evidence or even argument has been advanced so far, except a newspaper report which it was claimed turned all suspects into toast, but which we've known about for a year or more and doesn't.

[SPE]

...
ANd then we get the Lawende repeat as we always do from he Anti Aaron brigade....
So lets just quash this...Lawende wasnt the witness he makes no sense what so ever and does fit the known facts relating to the identification.
What does make sense is post PK565....'the kosminski family had 'blue eyes' they thus fitted the description given by Schwartz to Swanson..
Swanson, a credible life long policeman would have known a) what Aaron looked like and b) Schwartz desciption.
So why would he have bought in Lawende? are we suggesting he didnt know his job?
...
Jeff

I thought that you were lost somewhere crossing the Rubicon.

I didn't notice the description given by Schwartz included 'blue eyes'. In fact, to suggest that, in his fleeting look at the man attacking Stride on that dark night, Schwartz noticed the eye colour of the attacker is a nonsense. So to your list of manufactured 'facts' surrounding Schwartz you are now adding that Swanson 'would have known what Aaron looked like.' Really, and what facts support that contention? When did Swanson see Aaron? Also Aaron Kosminski was detained some two years after the murders, the alleged identification was carried out shortly before that detention and by that time Aaron had physically and mentally deteriorated and quite probably didn't look very much like he did back in 1888.

[SPE]

...
As for Trevor, he isn't actually saying anything, and, insofar as not having read Martin's book or knowing anything about his thinking or his theory indicates anything, he's probably none too certain what the arguments for any of the police suspects actually are. For the most part people just get a series of trite and meaningless statements about ships sinking, clocks ticking, and book burnings on the village green, and forthcoming evidence that'll kick all previous thinking into a cocked hat. That would delight me, as some major new discovery would be very welcome, but I can't help but wonder why he doesn't just present it and stop threatening it. So no good evidence or even argument has been advanced so far, except a newspaper report which it was claimed turned all suspects into toast, but which we've known about for a year or more and doesn't.

Ah, but Trevor, like Jeff, suffers from 'Ripper blindness', the definition of which is given below.

Ripper blindness = An obsession with a suspect, theory, or idea, to the degree that it is no longer a suspect, theory, or idea. The suspect is the Ripper and the theory or idea is fact to those suffering from this complaint. Thus they lose sight of what is real or factual and state their own opinion as fact. In extreme cases sufferers have been known to invent 'facts' to support their theorising.

It is generally reckoned to be incurable, but getting onto other subjects and lying peacefully in a darkened room can help.

[Jeff Leahy]

It would be interesting to see Phil Carter debate those points with you, although his argument seems to be that the sources don't constitute evidence against Kosminski et al, so arguments such as whether or not Schwartz witnessed the prelude to Stride's murder or the meaning of the Crawford letter is irrelevant to what he is saying. As for Trevor, he isn't actually saying anything, and, insofar as not having read Martin's book or knowing anything about his thinking or his theory indicates anything, he's probably none too certain what the arguments for any of the police suspects actually are. For the most part people just get a series of trite and meaningless statements about ships sinking, clocks ticking, and book burnings on the village green, and forthcoming evidence that'll kick all previous thinking into a cocked hat. That would delight me, as some major new discovery would be very welcome, but I can't help but wonder why he doesn't just present it and stop threatening it. So no good evidence or even argument has been advanced so far, except a newspaper report which it was claimed turned all suspects into toast, but which we've known about for a year or more and doesn't.

Hi Paul

Long day with bizarre incident while collecting apples for a photo, a wasp went down my shirt and I had to rip it off.....Spent the rest of day looking like the incredible Hulk....Its damn hot here in kent..

Still working on playouts, Jake arrives Friday...new models in place...totally knackered.....

Clearly I stand by the work we did last year and I hope you guys realize that I respect everything you say and did...

I just feel I want to move on now and explore the suspect side in ripperology, which was always my interest.

Beside our other work is going in new and better directions together..Caroline sends love to you..theres much work to be done..

I must admit I've been following the arguments and I'm not clear where Phil Carters arguments have been going? Its rather scatter gun..

As Stewart points out the ironey is the Trevor and I actually have much in common, as does Tom Wescott or even Mei Trow

At least we all believe in a lone serial killer suspect, if not with each others conclusions....very differnet from Phil carter

I dont think you should worry that I'd ever say anything other than you are he greatest Ripperologist known to me, even if at times we have our differences on 'Ripperology' matters.....

Besides its all a storm in a tea cup anyway, theres nothing new apart from PK565

Hopefully speak soon Jeff x

[Jeff Leahy]

Ah, but Trevor, like Jeff, suffers from 'Ripper blindness', the definition of which is given below.

Ripper blindness = An obsession with a suspect, theory, or idea, to the degree that it is no longer a suspect, theory, or idea. The suspect is the Ripper and the theory or idea is fact to those suffering from this complaint. Thus they lose sight of what is real or factual and state their own opinion as fact. In extreme cases sufferers have been known to invent 'facts' to support their theorising.

It is generally reckoned to be incurable, but getting onto other subjects and lying peacefully in a darkened room can help.

Blimmey two posts Stewart

Possibly your correct, a suspect ripperologist needs to focus on a suspect and dig...'you say tomato I'll say tomatoe'

Blind suggests unable to see and understand sensible argument against something. If that is your claim its not true. I do listen to sensible argument.

So lets go back to the 'blue eyed' revelation and why I think its a genuine game changer...

Until post PK565 we had no idea what Aaron Kosminski looked like..zilch

The revelation that all his known closest relatives had 'Blue Eyes' give us a different ethnic possibility from the usual 'cliche' perseptions

Actually Jewish people are far more likely to resemble the ethnic traits of teh country werre they come from than a 'middle eastern' ethnic look..

(I want to be sensitive here because my thought process would not wont to offend anyone of any ethnic origin, especially as I'm of an ethnic Irish origin myself)

But what we now know of Aaron, and yes I'd like to ask Chris Philips more about his conversation with the Kosminski family, is that they were probably 'Blue Eyed' and thus brown haired and typical of their Polish descent , NOT VERY TALL.

Theres no evidence Swanson saw Aaron as you say

But if he was being watched, and Swanson new Schwartz description are you saying that as a good coopper he wouldnt have asked?

Its all been turned on its head if Swanson had specific reason to beleive Aaron Kosminski matched Schwartz description

Lawende becomes irelivant in any thought process..

If Swanson believed Aaron matched the description given by Schwartz would that not effect his thinking?

Yours Jeff

PS I would like to thank you for your support of Martin and Paul on casebook, you are, 'what ever I may have said in haste in the past' and 'I admit my sometimes hasty critisism of yourself' a gentleman SIR.

PS PS I think i'm closer to the rubicon than even I suspected, I will of course resign from the feild as a matter of principle, I am nothing if not consistant, I wish you all well should this be our last words.

[Jeff Leahy]

ISo no good evidence or even argument has been advanced so far,

Um??

I think you should be very careful quoting Dr Lars Davidson.

His argument was fairly clear that 'Schizophrenics are largely not dangerous...which is true.

However Lars was clearly concerned that 'Schizophrenic' (hebophrenic's) should be demonized by the program, which is understandable and something I would not seek to do, and have never done.

But between the lines it must be obvious that on ocassions Hebophrenic Schizophrenics can become extremely dangerous..

The ripper murders are very rare and no responcible 'psychietrist' would be seen to 'demonize' people who are by and large very vonrable...

But both you and Martin have missunderstood what is being said..

Hebophenic Schizophrenics are the most logical explanation for this very rare type of crime.

YOurs Jeff

[Taylor]

Hi Paul

As Stewart points out the ironey is the Trevor and I actually have much in common, as does Tom Wescott or even Mei Trow



So what is it that keeps you from working together? ...can't you put your different views aside to put your minds together?


... Where can Canadians purchase a copy of JTR: The Definitive Story and will it come out in theaters there? :popcorn:

[Jeff Leahy]

So what is it that keeps you from working together? ...can't you put your different views aside to put your minds together?


... Where can Canadians purchase a copy of JTR: The Definitive Story and will it come out in theaters there? :popcorn:

Wearing my hat as a TV producer most certainly, although I'm rather busy at present on other projects not Ripper related...

I think my point is rather that should I choose to return to the subject I'd want to do Suspect based program...

So crossing the rubicon for me is about moving on...

However having spent the afternoon working on Garbage Mattes you will all be pleased to know the Clouds behind Dr Philips in 'Definitive Story' are now moving as originally intended...render time three hours what a fun weekend I'm going to have?

But yes we are booked to playout the DVD next weekend and it will be available on DVD...I dont know if it will play in Canada, Howard can play UK DVD's on his computer.

Yours Jeff

[Paul]

Um??

I think you should be very careful quoting Dr Lars Davidson.

His argument was fairly clear that 'Schizophrenics are largely not dangerous...which is true.

However Lars was clearly concerned that 'Schizophrenic' (hebophrenic's) should be demonized by the program, which is understandable and something I would not seek to do, and have never done.

But between the lines it must be obvious that on ocassions Hebophrenic Schizophrenics can become extremely dangerous..

The ripper murders are very rare and no responcible 'psychietrist' would be seen to 'demonize' people who are by and large very vonrable...

But both you and Martin have missunderstood what is being said..

Hebophenic Schizophrenics are the most logical explanation for this very rare type of crime.

YOurs Jeff

I've just noticed this, and I'm afraid that I really don't follow the logic here.

The point Dr. Lars made was that Aaron Kosminski was probably a hebephrenic schizophrenic and that schizophrenics are no more likely to commit acts of violence than anyone else. We all seem to be agreed on this. What he did not say, or I do not recall him saying, is that if a schizophrenic was going to commit an act of violence it would be a hebephrenic schizophrenic.

If he did, or if that is true, then it would weigh in favour of Aaron Kosminski's guilt in so far as he would probably have been suffering from the sort of mental illness most likely to erupt in acts of extreme violence. That, though, hasn't been said, at least as far as I am aware.

Whilst it isn't disputed that very rarely hebephrenic schizophrenics are capable of extreme acts of violence (and in my case it isn't disputed because I don't know whether they are or not), and nobody disputes that the Ripper murders are a very rare type of crime, you cannot logically conclude that the Ripper murders were therefore committed by a hebephrenic schizophrenic. That's a variation on the "all dogs have four legs, my cat has four legs, therefore my cat is a dog" type of reasoning: Jack the Ripper-type murders are very rare, acts of extreme violence by hebephrenic schizophrenics are extremely rare, therefore the Jack the Ripper murders were committed by a hebephrenic schizophrenic.

If the woman seen by Schwartz to have been apparently spontaneously assaulted was Elizabeth Stride and if the man who assaulted her was her murderer, then the apparent spontaneity of the assault and murder could suggest a disorganised killer and that would fit (or possibly suggest) a hebephrenic schizophrenic. I don't know, but there does seem to be a certain circularity to the argument. Perhaps it needs to be more fully and clearly explained.

[Jeff Leahy]

I've just noticed this, and I'm afraid that I really don't follow the logic here.

The point Dr. Lars made was that Aaron Kosminski was probably a hebephrenic schizophrenic and that schizophrenics are no more likely to commit acts of violence than anyone else. We all seem to be agreed on this. What he did not say, or I do not recall him saying, is that if a schizophrenic was going to commit an act of violence it would be a hebephrenic schizophrenic.

If he did, or if that is true, then it would weigh in favour of Aaron Kosminski's guilt in so far as he would probably have been suffering from the sort of mental illness most likely to erupt in acts of extreme violence. That, though, hasn't been said, at least as far as I am aware.

Whilst it isn't disputed that very rarely hebephrenic schizophrenics are capable of extreme acts of violence (and in my case it isn't disputed because I don't know whether they are or not), and nobody disputes that the Ripper murders are a very rare type of crime, you cannot logically conclude that the Ripper murders were therefore committed by a hebephrenic schizophrenic. That's a variation on the "all dogs have four legs, my cat has four legs, therefore my cat is a dog" type of reasoning: Jack the Ripper-type murders are very rare, acts of extreme violence by hebephrenic schizophrenics are extremely rare, therefore the Jack the Ripper murders were committed by a hebephrenic schizophrenic.

If the woman seen by Schwartz to have been apparently spontaneously assaulted was Elizabeth Stride and if the man who assaulted her was her murderer, then the apparent spontaneity of the assault and murder could suggest a disorganised killer and that would fit (or possibly suggest) a hebephrenic schizophrenic. I don't know, but there does seem to be a certain circularity to the argument. Perhaps it needs to be more fully and clearly explained.

Ok I understand what your getting at, and there is some truth that my opinions were largely formed around the advice given to me by Laars colleage. It was just that he couldnt do the program and recommended that Laars might be good as they work together.

I'll see what I can find on Hebophrenic Schizophrenia but my understanding is that this is the most potencially dangerous kind...

However as you know I'm very busy up until next weekend.

I'll get back on this.
Yours Jeff

[Paul]

Not a problem, Jeff. Don't worry about it.

[Jeff Leahy]

By the way did you get the letter? I didnt want to post it through door because of the dogs...Jx

[Paul]

By the way did you get the letter? I didnt want to post it through door because of the dogs...Jx

Yes, ta. I'll reply.

[Garry Wroe]

I'll see what I can find on Hebophrenic Schizophrenia but my understanding is that this is the most potencially dangerous kind...
On the contrary, Jeff. It is the paranoid schizophrenic who represents the greatest potential danger to others.

[Garry Wroe]

Yet when we look at schizophrenic serial killers there is no evidence I can see that suggests that once removed from the environment they work in that they are dangerous? Does Peter Sutcliff have a record for attacking guards or inmates? No he's completely harmless as Aaron appears to have been because Schizophrenics are NOT dangerous.
Here, I'm afraid, Jeff, you are comparing apples and oranges. Any modern day schizophrenic serialist undergoes a sophisticated treatment regimen upon arrest, including antipsychotic and other powerful drugs. Aaron Kosminski had no such medication. Despite this, however, he exhibited not the slightest hint of dangerousness in almost three decades of incarceration.