Celebrity Suspect

[How Brown]

Few suspects in the pantheon of Ripper "suspects" were written of and about as Tumbelty was.

There are more articles to be transcribed in the near future regarding Tumbelty which Nina has located and in perusing the finds she made,it sort of inspired me to set up this thread.

A cursory look at the list of suspects ( in example,the 150 or so that C.J. Morley put together for his 2005 book...) will often leave us shaking our heads such as Jill The Rippers...The Ape....etc... These "suspects" were the results of over-worked imaginations or mischief makers,to be kind.

However,in the case of Tumbelty...there is an article ( just placed on the site that Nina located ) which discusses among other things,Tumbelty being "rounded up with other crank and quack doctors" in the intense manhunt for Jack The Ripper.

It made me wonder if anyone else feels the same way that I do about Tumbelty...and I have been thinking about him quite a bit lately.

Tumbelty,with few exceptions,had a media apparatus available which cast seemingly every action he undertook ( or didn't undertake ) into a light that other equally "so-so" suspects didn't have.

If Tumbelty was pursued by Scotland Yard and due to the same circumstances which other "quack doctors" or eccentric types were possibly followed for,he had the distinct advantage of this apparatus being ever ready to publish the affair at hand.

In Mr.Evans' latest offering in RIP #82 ( August 2007 )....on page 16...he states that Tumbelty was "in denial" as to the charges of "womanhating". Yet,Tumbelty,to my and apparently some other folks,was ready and following his cue when he presented "evidence' to the contrary as to his misogynist tendencies. Tumbelty's "denial" is immediately responded to...which we are currently discussing on the thread, "Tumbelty's Better Half".

The gist of this post/thread.... is that Tumbelty courted controversy and unlike other individuals who may have been "suspected" under or by the same broad and general assessments ( "quack doctor", "crank surgeon" ), he and he alone got the ink others didn't due to his own celebrity apparatus which he had decades of experience in manifesting across the US and the UK...Canada and frankly,across the globe. Without it,Tumbelty is on the level of a Thomas Murphy...another suspect,but less heralded one.


Is anyone else of this opinion about Tumbelty?

[Chris G.]

. . . The gist of this post/thread.... is that Tumbelty courted controversy and unlike other individuals who may have been "suspected" under or by the same broad and general assessments ( "quack doctor", "crank surgeon" ), he and he alone got the ink others didn't due to his own celebrity apparatus which he had decades of experience in manifesting across the US and the UK...Canada and frankly,across the globe. Without it,Tumbelty is on the level of a Thomas Murphy...another suspect,but less heralded one.


Is anyone else of this opinion about Tumbelty?

Hello Howard

Indeed, I agree with you, Howard, that Tumbley courted controversy. His detention at the time of the Whitechapel murders fitted right into his agenda: the whiff of suspicion that he could have been "Jack" was excellent for business and for promotion of his projects.

I really think that this is the real reason why he is not mentioned (or is hardly mentioned) in English press reports, that Tumblety made darned sure he was mentioned as a Whitechapel murder suspect in the American press. As Stewart Evans himself says in his article in Ripperologist no. 82 just published, "Slouch-hatted Yankee," Tumblety knew there was insufficient evidence to extradite him to England. All the British police had was the gross indecency charges that they had him on before he jumped bail -- insufficient to bring him back to England. So in other words, he was free to trumpet himself and how he was "wronged" by Scotland Yard, and meanwhile, promote his medical practice.

Was Dr. Francis Tumblety the Whitechapel murderer or was he not? It is hard to say -- but I think there is more than enough indication that at least he used the Whitechapel murders to his advantage.

Chris

[Robert Linford]

Hi Chris and How

Certainly one gets the impression that Tumblety would rather he were thought of as a JTR suspect than a gross indecency suspect. If I remember correctly, he doesn't mention the gross indecency charges at all - yet says he was actually charged with the murders, when of course he wasn't.

A normal person might have been expected to push the line "No, I was never suspected of murder, only of gross indecency." Tumblety seems to have found Jack's top hat and cape a comfortable fit.

Robert

[How Brown]

Dear Chris and Robert:

Having read the recent article in Ripperologist ( #82,August ) by Mr. Evans....I noticed this comment made:

" What does seem rather relevant,in retrospect,is the fact that the London police make no mention of Tumbelty's arrest on supicion of the murders,whilst Tumbelty makes no mention of his arrest and subsequent charging for the gross indeceny offenses.."

Umm...I don't think there's very many men who would willingly discuss being charged with gross indecency offenses even in today's "anything goes" society....much less in 1888. Its perfectly understandable that regardless of whatever Tumbelty did wish to discuss in this interview...being charged with what he was charged with would have been avoided at all costs....even for an attention whore like Tumbelty.

Robert....I am not certain of course....but since there is (to date)no mention of Tumbelty by name in the British press releases of the day...and this might get resolved within time for sure...that I believe Tumbelty might have wired ahead to the American press ( in this instance,New York,where he was to arrive...) and told them of the "arrest for possible complicity" in the WM. In other words,Tumbelty was the reason that the Americans seemed to have more facts on this situation ( albeit they constantly misspell his name left and right....) than the British did.

I think that Tumbelty wanted the celebrity that Jack The Ripper had attained and although I don't feel he wanted to be known necessarily as the Whitechapel Murderer....he craved the attention that JTR was definitely attracting. What better way of doing so,without the mess of handcuffs,court appearances,etc...than to assume this celebrity by proxy?

I mean,for chrissakes, the press openly accused Ostrog and Pizer prior to this November scenario,but they fail to mention Tumbelty ( as an example of how I think Tumbelty exacerbated this entire situation....and being that many individuals....the "usual suspects" if you will...who engaged in deviant sexual behavior were rounded up and arrested/detained...of them only Tumbelty has a media apparatus available...).

Anyone else?

[Chris G.]

Dear Chris and Robert:

Having read the recent article in Ripperologist ( #82,August ) by Mr. Evans....I noticed this comment made:

" What does seem rather relevant,in retrospect,is the fact that the London police make no mention of Tumbelty's arrest on supicion of the murders,whilst Tumbelty makes no mention of his arrest and subsequent charging for the gross indeceny offenses.."

Umm...I don't think there's very many men who would willingly discuss being charged with gross indecency offenses even in today's "anything goes" society....much less in 1888. Its perfectly understandable that regardless of whatever Tumbelty did wish to discuss in this interview...being charged with what he was charged with would have been avoided at all costs....even for an attention whore like Tumbelty.

Robert....I am not certain of course....but since there is (to date)no mention of Tumbelty by name in the British press releases of the day...and this might get resolved within time for sure...that I believe Tumbelty might have wired ahead to the American press ( in this instance,New York,where he was to arrive...) and told them of the "arrest for possible complicity" in the WM. In other words,Tumbelty was the reason that the Americans seemed to have more facts on this situation ( albeit they constantly misspell his name left and right....) than the British did.

I think that Tumbelty wanted the celebrity that Jack The Ripper had attained and although I don't feel he wanted to be known necessarily as the Whitechapel Murderer....he craved the attention that JTR was definitely attracting. What better way of doing so,without the mess of handcuffs,court appearances,etc...than to assume this celebrity by proxy?

I mean,for chrissakes, the press openly accused Ostrog and Pizer prior to this November scenario,but they fail to mention Tumbelty ( as an example of how I think Tumbelty exacerbated this entire situation....and being that many individuals....the "usual suspects" if you will...who engaged in deviant sexual behavior were rounded up and arrested/detained...of them only Tumbelty has a media apparatus available...).

Anyone else?

Hi Howard

I would not have put it past Tumblety to telegraph the American newspapers of his immanent arrival and that he had been suspected by the British police of being the Whitechapel murderer. Or if he did not wire the press, he might have wired someone like McGarry to tip the newspapermen off as to what was in the wind.

What is interesting about the interview is that yes, as you point out, he patently does not mention the gross indecency charges, for obvious reasons, but he does take advantage of the interview to tweak the noses of the British police, characterizing them as dumb and inept and claiming that he was arrested just for having an American style hat.

What was Tumblety's intent here? Was he currying up to Inspector Byrne for some reason? In saying that Inspector Byrne would have caught the murderer, as Byrne himself of course said he would done, was he seeking to please the Irish American community or was there more to it? Was there some sort of relationship between Byrne and possibly the Fenians that was hinted at, and that the newspaper article was part of a game plan to embarrass the British? Or else, again, was this just another example of Dr. Tumblety's self-promotion?

All the best

Chris

[Robert Linford]

It's possible that Tumblety publicised his own suspect-status. But he missed a trick a little later in failing to latch on to the Florence Maybrick business - both cases could have been hung on an "Americans ill-treated by British justice" peg that would have gone down well in the US press.

Robert

[Chris G.]

It's possible that Tumblety publicised his own suspect-status. But he missed a trick a little later in failing to latch on to the Florence Maybrick business - both cases could have been hung on an "Americans ill-treated by British justice" peg that would have gone down well in the US press.

Robert

Hi Robert

Yes you are right that Tumblety could have used the Maybrick case to advantage to further illustrate the "Americans ill-treated by British justice" theme. Although I doubt if he would have. Rather, Tumblety only seemed to weigh in on certain themes in the press when he himself personally was the main actor. Since he had no role in the Maybrick case it probably would not have suited him to comment.

Chris

[Robert Linford]

I don't know, Chris. It would have been a way of keeping his name in the news. "They've done to her what they tried to do to me."

Robert

[Chris G.]

I don't know, Chris. It would have been a way of keeping his name in the news. "They've done to her what they tried to do to me."

Robert

No, I don't think so. Much like the poet Sylvia Plath, Dr. Tumblety was his own main subject. It was always that somebody had done something to Dr. Tumblety.

Chris

[A.P. Wolf]

Personally I feel Robert has landed a very big fish there with his remarks about the Maybrick case and the anti-British sentiment there was in America at exactly this time period.
Tumblety was a minnow in the muddy waters of the English LVP but he was big fish in America... I wonder how many other Jack the Ripper suspects have been accused of complicity in the murder of an American president?
Not many eh?
And that is precisely the reason that I feel the door shuts on Tumblety as a suspect, for he is named as a suspect in a totally unrelated case of murder, just like Maybrick.
This doesn't happen to serial killers.
They either eat cornflakes, or do porridge.

[R.J.Palmer]

I mean,for chrissakes, the press openly accused Ostrog and Pizer prior to this November scenario

Hello Howard. Uh, I think you're remembering the alert put out for Ostrog's whereabouts--which appeared in the Police Gazette--but his name was never actually mentioned in connection to the murders. (See below)

I really think that this is the real reason why he is not mentioned (or is hardly mentioned) in English press reports..."
Chris

Chris,

The trouble is, the Metropolitan Police were extremely tight-lipped about their suspects. They didn’t talk about them to the press--unless they were exonerated. The Macnaghten memo makes this very clear. Druitt, Kosminski, and Ostrog were all police suspects, but their names were never mentioned in ANY press report in connection with the murders. The only reason we know about them as suspects is because Macnaghten's private memo mentions them (or, in regards to Kosminski, the Swanson marginalia). So, I wouldn't agree with any suggestion that the silence of the British press is somehow trumping what Littlechild is trying to tell us.

Let's take a moment to contemplate Tommy Cutbush. Mentioned in the press by The Sun, but is this not an exception that proves the rule? It is clear from Macnaghten that Cutbush was investigated for being the Ripper in 1891, but his name wasn’t mentioned in the press in connection with the crimes until three years later--1894-- when someone at The Sun published their theory. The press got wind of Cutbush, and only by the merest of luck (and Dan Farson) did we get a sense of what the police were doing behind-the-scenes. I'd say the same is true of Tumblety: the press is just the distorted shadow on the wall. Littlechild's letter confirms that there was 'something to it," but he doesn't tell us what that something was. RP

[Chris G.]

Hi RJ

You make some excellent points. Many thanks.

Chris

[How Brown]

Dear R.J.

Thanks for the reply and the reference to Ostrog. My bad.