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Old July 23rd, 2017, 12:02 AM   #11
Jerry Dunlop
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One more quick observation.

PC Andrews:

Lloyds Weekly Newspaper July 21, 1889

Had you been in the alley before? Yes, between 20 and 25 past twelve. This is before I found the body. As police-constable Allen came out I went in and was there between two and three minutes. Nobody was there then. After leaving the alley I went half way to Goulston-street, and then down the other side, returning into Old Castle-street and through into Castle-alley. At 25 past 12 I passed from the alley into New Castle-street, up one side of the High-street, Whitechapel, and into Goulston-street, returning into Whitechapel High-street. Then I went into Middlesex-street, into Wentworth-street again, when I saw Sergeant Badham, as I stated at the commencement of my evidence. This would have taken 27 minutes.

Sergeant Badham:

The Times, Thursday, July 18th, 1889

[Coroner] Had you been in the alley at all that night? - No.

So, when PC Andrews meets Badham opposite the Three Crowns, he is approaching from Wentworth Street heading toward the alley and the Three Crowns. Sergeant Badham had not been in the alley at all that night. That means that Badham also must have approached the Three Crowns from the northerly direction, walking down Old Castle Street from Wentworth. Since neither man states he saw the other anywhere in Old Castle Street, this must mean one arrived at the Three Crowns before the other. They each claim to have met each other at 12:48 or 12:50. So who arrived first and how much earlier than 12:48 did that policeman arrive?
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Old July 23rd, 2017, 03:35 AM   #12
Monty
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Interesting thread Jerry

An excerpt from my book which may be of interest.

Monty



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Old July 23rd, 2017, 03:37 AM   #13
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Whoa!

That's obviously the large print version for the elderly. My apologies.

How, can you please rectify as you deem fit. Many thanks and sorry for mucking you about.

Cheers

Monty
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Old July 23rd, 2017, 04:19 AM   #14
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Quote:
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That's obviously the large print version for the elderly.
Don't apologise. I found it very valuable! This isn't the place, Neil, but the enlarged text made me wonder if there was any chance that Amberley will give us a Kindle version of your book - which, incidentally, is a book anyone interested in this subject should have on their bookshelf. But my virtual bookshelf wants one too.
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Old July 23rd, 2017, 08:01 AM   #15
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Neil:

No problem...thank you for the scan.
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Old July 23rd, 2017, 11:45 AM   #16
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Don't apologise. I found it very valuable! This isn't the place, Neil, but the enlarged text made me wonder if there was any chance that Amberley will give us a Kindle version of your book - which, incidentally, is a book anyone interested in this subject should have on their bookshelf. But my virtual bookshelf wants one too.
Hi Paul,

Just to reply to your post.

It was pointed out to me that the kindle version has indeed disappeared. I contacted Amberley who informed me that the removal was an error made during the introduction of the paperback.

In short, they are working on it. Expect an announcement soon.

Now back to Castle Alley.

Monty
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Old July 23rd, 2017, 12:28 PM   #17
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Neil,

Thanks for the post on the whistle procedure. I find the timing of the notice shortly after the murder in Castle Alley interesting. As you know from another thread, I feel the evidence shows that PC Andrews did not blow his whistle until after questioning Isaac Lewis Jacobs. That would be, as we know, several minutes after he discovered the body of Alice McKenzie.
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Old July 23rd, 2017, 12:44 PM   #18
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Neil,

Thanks for the post on the whistle procedure. I find the timing of the notice shortly after the murder in Castle Alley interesting. As you know from another thread, I feel the evidence shows that PC Andrews did not blow his whistle until after questioning Isaac Lewis Jacobs. That would be, as we know, several minutes after he discovered the body of Alice McKenzie.
Blowing the whistle set in motion a whole procedure that involved numerous officers. Maybe officers stalled the action a bit to make sure it was needed. Surely if an officer thought he had the criminal he would have requested backup ASAP?
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Old July 23rd, 2017, 12:56 PM   #19
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Blowing the whistle set in motion a whole procedure that involved numerous officers. Maybe officers stalled the action a bit to make sure it was needed. Surely if an officer thought he had the criminal he would have requested backup ASAP?
Hi Anna,

The problem is, in early interviews with the press, Andrews was quoted as saying he blew the whistle immediately upon finding the body and then the sergeant arrived a few minutes later. This just isn't the case after putting all the testimony together as a whole.
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Old July 23rd, 2017, 05:01 PM   #20
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Neil,

Thanks for the post on the whistle procedure. I find the timing of the notice shortly after the murder in Castle Alley interesting. As you know from another thread, I feel the evidence shows that PC Andrews did not blow his whistle until after questioning Isaac Lewis Jacobs. That would be, as we know, several minutes after he discovered the body of Alice McKenzie.
I agree Jerry.

The reissuing of this memo was, IMHO, a refresher for Constables. The date is significant I feel.

Monty
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