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5 Questions With : Jon L. Rees -- Dec. 10, 2013

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  • 5 Questions With : Jon L. Rees -- Dec. 10, 2013

    Facing the prospect of being fired from his high paying position as Forums Moderator, Jon cheerfully responded to the call of the 5Q....
    Thanks JR !

    *********************************


    1. What speech or presentation at the recent convention ( I'm sure they were all excellent...) would you care to briefly touch on ?

    I think it would be unfair to single out any one presentation so I’ll mention a few that stood out. Neil Storey’s after dinner talk was no doubt the most entertaining of the weekend - hearing him describe Whitechapel After Dark with his engaging speaking style and presentation skills really helped invoke the atmosphere. Melanie Clegg did a great job Saturday morning talking about Mary Kelly and setting the scene for the day. Philip Hutchinson was the absolute professional, doing his talk in the pouring rain and hardly being heard. And finally Sir Christopher Fralying’s memories of producing the Shadow of the Ripper documentary gave an interesting insight into the centenary interest in the crimes.

    2. What trend(s) do you see in the field occuring that are positive signs to you ?

    Well I’ve already mentioned in a few threads my belief that we are now expecting higher standards out of suspect books and debunking in journals those that do not live up to this. The Facebook Ripper communities are really growing in popularity and are helping those with a casual interest learn more about the crimes. Finally the conferences are going from strength to strength and each one is trying to be new and different and keep interest in the case and these events.

    3. Based on your own presentation at the 2013 Convention, are there any witnesses who testified during the Inquest hearings back in 1888 that you feel we should be wary of in late 2013 ?

    I think we should be wary of all eyewitness testimony. Not necessarily discount it, but proceed with caution. Psychological research has consistently shown that eyewitnesses can be extremely unreliable and human memory can be malleable and permanently altered. I hope that my little demonstration at the conference just hoped to show in a practical way.

    4. At this point in time...no need to fear you contradicting yourself in any previous response to this question....how many victims do you feel were killed by the same man in 1888-1891 ?

    Five or six, depends what mood you catch me in. I’m personally convinced that Martha Tabram was Jack’s first victim and was an early, more sloppy killing.

    Followed by Nichols and Chapman. Stride leaves some doubt in my mind - my opinion on her differs frequently with some thoughts or perspective changing it. For the last few months she’s been a no. Then Eddowes and finally Kelly.

    Not convinced by any of the later ones currently.

    5. Any chance of the Ripper killing abroad ?

    Never say never, but we’ll never know.

    6. If the Whitechapel Murders had occurred in America....would they hold the same interest to you as they do now ?
    P.S. Personally, if they happened in Philadelphia, I might have the same interest that I do now...but no where else in America.-HB

    I honestly don’t know. I have some knowledge on American Serial Killers, but nowhere near that of British ones and certainly nowhere near the knowledge of the Ripper. So I suppose it’s probably a no.

    7. Give us the name of a suspect you feel we, as a community, undervalue…..

    Sir John Williams. That Jenni Shelden is part of a conspiracy to keep the truth from us.

    Seriously though - while I do read suspect books from time to time my interest is now mostly in the type of person the Ripper was, rather than who he actually was.
    To Join JTR Forums :
    Contact [email protected]

  • #2
    Originally posted by How Come?
    Any chance of the Ripper killing abroad ?
    What are you on about, mate? He killed at least 5 of 'em.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Howard Brown View Post
      Facing the prospect of being fired from his high paying position as Forums Moderator, Jon cheerfully responded to the call of the 5Q....
      Can I come out of the cellar now?
      Jon

      "It is far more comfortable to point a finger and declare someone a devil, than to call upon your imagination to try to understand their world."


      http://www.jlrees.co.uk



      Comment


      • #4
        other

        Hello Jon. Thanks for the discussion.

        What is it about the later killings--McKenzie and Coles--that you see as making them by another hand?

        Cheers.
        LC

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Howard Brown View Post

          7. Give us the name of a suspect you feel we, as a community, undervalue…..

          Sir John Williams. That Jenni Shelden is part of a conspiracy to keep the truth from us.
          I knew it!

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Lynn Cates View Post
            Hello Jon. Thanks for the discussion.

            What is it about the later killings--McKenzie and Coles--that you see as making them by another hand?

            Cheers.
            LC
            It's the gap. Eight months for McKenzie and then over a year for Coles - after 5 murders in quick succession, it seems to be a large gap. I'm not saying it's impossible (for example, the killer may have been incarcerated) but I just think it is unlikely.
            Jon

            "It is far more comfortable to point a finger and declare someone a devil, than to call upon your imagination to try to understand their world."


            http://www.jlrees.co.uk



            Comment


            • #7
              analogy

              Hello Jon. Thanks. No analogy with (was it Zodiac?) who had a long lull?

              Cheers.
              LC

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Lynn Cates View Post
                Hello Jon. Thanks. No analogy with (was it Zodiac?) who had a long lull?
                Zodiac did indeed take a long sabbatical, Lynn, but when he came back he was up to his usual tricks. For me, the key differentiator between Mackenzie/Coles and the Canonical Five (even within the Canonical Five) is not the gap, but what the killer actually did to the victims. Coles, Mackenzie (and Stride for that matter), got away very lightly compared with Nichols, Chapman, Eddowes and Kelly - or Tabram, even. The deaths of the latter were extraordinarily brutal, whereas one is tempted to classify the other murders as "run of the mill".

                My 4d
                Kind regards, Sam Flynn

                "Suche Nullen"
                (F. Nietzsche)

                Comment


                • #9
                  Gareth:
                  Do you or do you not feel that the position of Mackenzie's body is relevant ?
                  She was left much like Chapman and Eddowes were....of course, without the damage those poor women suffered....but with legs spread apart.
                  Its the major 'reason' I don't discount her.
                  To Join JTR Forums :
                  Contact [email protected]

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re Stride and Coles.

                    A disturbance?

                    Monty

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Lynn Cates View Post
                      Hello Jon. Thanks. No analogy with (was it Zodiac?) who had a long lull?

                      Cheers.
                      LC
                      If there was a gap followed by another series of murders, I'd be more convinced. But

                      gap - one murder - longer gap - another one murder

                      just doesn't seem to fit the pattern to me.

                      Didn't Zodiac have a six month gap at the start of the series and then the subsequent killings more closer together?
                      Jon

                      "It is far more comfortable to point a finger and declare someone a devil, than to call upon your imagination to try to understand their world."


                      http://www.jlrees.co.uk



                      Comment


                      • #12
                        bruising

                        Hello Gareth. Thanks.

                        So the bruising on Alice does not sway you?

                        Cheers.
                        LC

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          gap

                          Hello Jon. Thanks.

                          Well, what length of time constitutes a gap?

                          Cheers.
                          LC

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Big Jon View Post
                            If there was a gap followed by another series of murders, I'd be more convinced. But

                            gap - one murder - longer gap - another one murder

                            just doesn't seem to fit the pattern to me.

                            Didn't Zodiac have a six month gap at the start of the series and then the subsequent killings more closer together?
                            Yes but here we go again. With due respect, Jon, it appear that you concentrate too much on the Ripper case, albeit with recognition of the Zodiac case. The examples of the Green River killer (Gary Ridgeway) and the BTK killer (Dennis Rader), who both lay low for significant periods, would argue that a serial killer can for one reason or another stop killing for a long period.

                            That having been said, I discount both Tabram (too unlike the murders to follow, no throat cutting or evisceration) and all later murders after November 1888 such as McKenzie and Coles (the appearance of copy cats, with plain and simple throat cuttings and no significant bowel attack in contrast to Nichols, Chapman, Eddowes, and Kelly, discounting Stride and taking the traditional view that he was interrupted).

                            Best regards

                            Chris
                            Christopher T. George, Lyricist & Co-Author, "Jack the Musical"
                            https://www.facebook.com/JackTheMusical/ Hear sample song at https://tinyurl.com/y8h4envx.

                            Organizer, RipperCon #JacktheRipper-#True Crime Conferences, April 2016 and 2018.
                            Hear RipperCon 2016 & 2018 talks at http://www.casebook.org/podcast/.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Howard Brown View Post
                              Do you or do you not feel that the position of Mackenzie's body is relevant.
                              If I were attacked by a strangler, How, I'm pretty sure I wouldn't keep my legs together - I'd be thrashing them around like mad. They'd therefore naturally be parted when my assailant laid me on the ground. I'd thrash them a sight more if he had to sit on my chest to finish me off, with possibly more dramatic "splaying" as a result.

                              Of course, where sex is involved, either as a pretext or in actuality, then the legs are likely to be parted in any case.

                              For these reasons, I don't see splayed legs as necessarily linking crimes to a single murderer, any more the presence of exit wounds would suggest that the same gunman was involved in various shootings.
                              Originally posted by Monty View Post
                              Re Stride and Coles. A disturbance?
                              Indeed, Monty... but one has to posit such a Deus ex machina to make their murders "fit". Without resorting to such devices, all we basically have is a "bog-standard" cut-throat murder.
                              Originally posted by Lynn Cates View Post
                              So the bruising on Alice does not sway you?
                              It's a bit like spread legs or exit wounds, Lynn. Bruising could be seen as an inevitable byproduct of a violent assault, perpetrated by any hand.
                              Kind regards, Sam Flynn

                              "Suche Nullen"
                              (F. Nietzsche)

                              Comment

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