'What a pretty necklace'.

[AP Wolf]

I'm up for a discussion of the 'September 17th letter', popularly described by a few Rippersaurs as 'bogus' 'crass' 'dubious' and a 'hoax', consisting of a 'concotion of elements' and 'written with some sort of ball point pen'.

I reckon if I was going to forge a document about this case I'd use a typewriter of the time and not a pen.
I was looking at one in an antique shop only the other day, still with its original ink band, and I thought to my good self 'hmmm'.

[Howard Brown]

The September 17th letter transcription

In conjunction with A.P.'s thread starter...

Transcription)

17th Sept 1888

Dear Boss

So now they say I am a Yid when will they lern Dear old Boss! You an me know the truth dont we. Lusk can look forever hell never find me but I am rite under his nose all the time. I watch them looking for me an it gives me fits ha ha I love my work an I shant stop until I get buckled and even then watch out for your old pal Jacky.
Catch me if you Can Jack the Ripper
Sorry about the blood still messy from the last one. What a pretty necklace I gave her.

[Howard Brown]

The September 17th letter

The letter in question.....

[AP Wolf]

Thanks How
I realise that many have been totally dismissive of this missive, but that doesn't mean we can't do a bit of exploring.
Just for a jolly, wouldn't you?

I see that much is made of the use of the term 'buckled', but it was a very common term of the LVP, most often used to mean 'getting down to something' or 'applying effort'.
The expression 'pretty necklace' is at least original, and lends an authentic smudge I think.
If this was written with a biro then I'm the Maharajah of Cooch Behar.

[Chris G.]

Thanks How
I realise that many have been totally dismissive of this missive, but that doesn't mean we can't do a bit of exploring.
Just for a jolly, wouldn't you?

I see that much is made of the use of the term 'buckled', but it was a very common term of the LVP, most often used to mean 'getting down to something' or 'applying effort'.
The expression 'pretty necklace' is at least original, and lends an authentic smudge I think.
If this was written with a biro then I'm the Maharajah of Cooch Behar.

Hi AP

It's not so much that the letter is written in biro (if it is, that is) but that it appears to be so derivative of the other better known "Ripper" letters, that it lacks official markings from Scotland Yard or the PRO, and that it popped up in the PRO at the time of the Centennial in 1988. I would back it for a hoax, along with the Diary. I will grant you that "What a pretty necklace I gave her" is an unusual and novel phrase, but the sentence is still not inconsistent with the tone of the letters that are provably from 1888 onward. But then so is the phraseology in the Diary.

Chris

[AP Wolf]

Thanks Chris
my understanding is that the letter is deemed to be a hoax for the following reasons:

No stamp
No envelope.
No reference number.
No covering report.
No official comment.
No PRO archival stamp.
No police markings.

Fine. But surely all of that applies to the Littlechild letter which many view as the genuine article?

[Chris G.]

Hi AP

But the Littlechild letter was never in the Public Record Office, and this one was, as, indeed, presumably, if it is a true letter from 1888, it was in the Met files before that. So your comparison does not hold water. The point is this letter exhibits neither Met or PRO markings and it appeared suspiciously at the time of the Centennial when no one, apparently, had seen the thing before.

Chris

[SirRobertAnderson]

The point is this letter exhibits neither Met or PRO markings and it appeared suspiciously at the time of the Centennial when no one, apparently, had seen the thing before.

Chris

But as you'll recall, Chris, other 'evidence' was returned anonymously for the Centennial.....

[SirRobertAnderson]

I see that much is made of the use of the term 'buckled', but it was a very common term of the LVP, most often used to mean 'getting down to something' or 'applying effort'.

This is a post of GH's from the Casebook:

6th July 2006, 05:53 PM
Grey Hunter
Chief Inspector


It is, of course, totally wrong to persist in saying that the bogus 17 Sept. 1888 letter is confirmed in any way shape or form by the phrase 'I shan't quit ripping them till I do get buckled' in the orginal 'Dear Boss' letter received on 27 September 1888. In fact, the phrase 'I love my work an I shant stop untill I get buckled' in the bogus 17 Sept. letter is adapted from the original 'Dear Boss' letter.

The original 'Dear Boss letter starts "I keep on hearing the police have caught me..." and the phrase "I shan't quit ripping them till I do get buckled." merely harks back to the opening sentence about hearing of having been caught and not to any previous communication. It is clear from all the contemporary reports surrounding the 'Dear Boss' letter dated 25 Sept. 1888 that it was the first of its kind received.

The fact that the crass 17 Sept. letter 'borrows' from the original 'Dear Boss' letter, 'saucy Jacky' postcard and Lusk letter merely reinforces the conclusion that it is a hoax. It's provenance indicates that it is a hoax that originated in the 1980s. As for the ink its written with, I await a proper analysis to confirm its type and the sort of pen that produced it. An examination of it gives the impression that it is recent and is a modern ink, possibly written with some sort of ball point pen.

[Chris G.]

This is a post of GH's from the Casebook:

6th July 2006, 05:53 PM
Grey Hunter
Chief Inspector


It is, of course, totally wrong to persist in saying that the bogus 17 Sept. 1888 letter is confirmed in any way shape or form by the phrase 'I shan't quit ripping them till I do get buckled' in the orginal 'Dear Boss' letter received on 27 September 1888. In fact, the phrase 'I love my work an I shant stop untill I get buckled' in the bogus 17 Sept. letter is adapted from the original 'Dear Boss' letter.

The original 'Dear Boss letter starts "I keep on hearing the police have caught me..." and the phrase "I shan't quit ripping them till I do get buckled." merely harks back to the opening sentence about hearing of having been caught and not to any previous communication. It is clear from all the contemporary reports surrounding the 'Dear Boss' letter dated 25 Sept. 1888 that it was the first of its kind received.

The fact that the crass 17 Sept. letter 'borrows' from the original 'Dear Boss' letter, 'saucy Jacky' postcard and Lusk letter merely reinforces the conclusion that it is a hoax. It's provenance indicates that it is a hoax that originated in the 1980s. As for the ink its written with, I await a proper analysis to confirm its type and the sort of pen that produced it. An examination of it gives the impression that it is recent and is a modern ink, possibly written with some sort of ball point pen.

Hi Bob

I realise that you are quoting GH's letter but surely he is wrong here in saying, "It is clear from all the contemporary reports surrounding the 'Dear Boss' letter dated 25 Sept. 1888 that it was the first of its kind received."

In fact, the September 24 "horse slauterer" letter was received prior to the September 25 letter.

See p. 7 Evans and Skinner, Jack the Ripper: Letters from Hell which shows images of that letter and envelope with the caption:

"Envelope and letter of the 24 September 1888, the first anonymous correspondence allegedly from the Whitechapel murderer. It pre-dates the famous 'Dear Boss' letter."

Chris

[SirRobertAnderson]

In fact, the September 24 "horse slauterer" letter was received prior to the September 25 letter.


Chris

Thanks for raising this point, Chris.

Here's a link to a nice reproduction of the letter:

http://www.learningcurve.gov.uk/workshops/document7a.pdf

[AP Wolf]

I'm interested in the concept and idea that the use of 'Dear Boss' was somehow exclusive to a specific letter or even specific case of murder.
Here's another case from 1910, the 'Battersea Flat Murder', with absolutely no connection whatsoever to the Whitechapel Murders; and bless me I found what I thought I would never find, a 'Dear Boss' letter.

[AP Wolf]

I don't know whether I'm happier with a letter connected to this case that starts with 'Dear Boss' or 'Dear Sir'?
I must say that I am somewhat disturbed that the greatest critic of this particular letter, found by chance in a file at the PRO, is the same man who came across another controversial letter in even less well documented circumstances.
Looking at this 'pretty necklace' letter in its place in history I must say that I am far more comfortable of accepting the notion that such a letter could remain undiscovered in official files for many years; than I am of accepting the Littlechild letter as a genuine letter in its place in history.

The language and attitude that has been used in previous discussions about the 'pretty necklace' letter also disturb me.
Why the vitriol?
Why the anger?
If the letter is a fake then surely we can discuss that circumstance without vitriol or anger?
What am I talking about?
I forgot, I'm the same man who tried to discuss the Littlechild letter in a reasonable and sane manner, and all I got was vitriol, anger, mass resignations and sackings and a hell of a lot of hype and tripe for my trouble.
Hopefully we can discuss this letter like gentlemen; and ladies.
I like this letter.

[SirRobertAnderson]

I must say that I am somewhat disturbed that the greatest critic of this particular letter, found by chance in a file at the PRO, is the same man who came across another controversial letter in even less well documented circumstances.
Looking at this 'pretty necklace' letter in its place in history I must say that I am far more comfortable of accepting the notion that such a letter could remain undiscovered in official files for many years; than I am of accepting the Littlechild letter as a genuine letter in its place in history.

Before we get deeper into the Malay jungle, I think it is important to reiterate the official Forums position that the provenance of the Littlechild letter is pristine and unquestionable.

Personally, I'd rather render unto Littlechild that which is Littlechild's , and to McClelland's discovery what is his, and keep the discussion of the two letters separate. It's going to get heated enough as is.

[AP Wolf]

Good idea, Sir Robert.
Better to keep the two as one.
I'm happy with that.

Going on the 'Dear Boss' angle, this expression was not at all unusual in the LVP - and I know Natalie will enjoy this - especially amongst the Irish community hiding out from the 'Special Branch' in the USA.
An article in 'The Times', May 20th 1887, describes Alexander Sullivan as the 'Boss' of Clan-na-Gael.