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  • Nevermind the Bollards

    How has encouraged me to go ahead and put some Ripper-related material on my Individual Forum.

    I decided to start this thread because I often come across interesting historical information, free online resources, down-loadable out-of-print books, etc, but I frequently don't know where to put them in the JtR Forum categories.

    >>I will try to keep this thread to subjects regarding the Victorian Era, the Ripper, London,
    19th Century History and items that I hope will be useful and enjoyable Reference Sources for all of you.

    Please feel free to comment on them & discuss them here, too.

    Thanks, Archaic

    PS: Thread title is explained in the next post

  • #2
    Bollards Led Me To A Terrfic Online Resource!

    I found this wonderful website one day while I was researching bollards, those upright metal posts which serve to block traffic. London is full of them, but they are quite rare in America. Apparently after the defeat of Napoleon,
    his captured cannon were actually pressed into service as ordinary street bollards... I'd love to know if any remain. (I doubt it)

    This website was created by a man who was trying to help his grandson set up historically accurate model railway layouts. It is so full of obscure historical information that I was amazed. He goes into minute detail, discusses the origins of things, and traces their development over the years. I think those of you interested in 'Old London' will particularly enjoy this site.

    Of course there is a large section devoted to Trains, but what I found so informative was the huge section called "Outside the Railway Fence". Take a look through the index in the link below and just click on any subject that catches your eye; i think you'll have fun.

    I will post a few of my favorite sub-links and describe them, but some of the topics covered include roads, signage, shops, pubs, tradespeople, street hawkers, parks, horse-drawn vehicles, early motorized vehicles, steam vehicles, churches, law courts, games and past-times, sewers, street lights & lighting, envisioning original buildings and shop-fronts... the list goes on and on. And oh yeah, trains!

    Go to this link & click on Appendix One, called "Outside The Railway Fence." The INDEX will come up.

    http://www.igg.org.uk/gansg/index.htm#apps

    Comment


    • #3
      Fav Sub-Links from "Outside the Railway Fence"

      Domestic, Industrial, & Street Lighting:
      http://www.igg.org.uk/gansg/00-app1/light.htm

      Road Traffic: Hand-Carts, Horse-Drawn Vehicles & Bicycles
      http://www.igg.org.uk/gansg/00-app1/rthdbike.htm

      Street-Traders, Hawkers & Buskers
      http://www.igg.org.uk/gansg/00-app1/trade-st.htm

      Comment


      • #4
        Great links, Bunny. Love the one about lamps, etc.

        Comment


        • #5
          Sammy:

          I just came from that link and thought of you and Robert Clack and Neil right off the bat....

          This lady, Archaic, is really putting some great links up for the membership and despite our differences in opinion on things ( I'm right, she's wrong), she is a real right hand lady.
          To Join JTR Forums :
          Contact Howard@jtrforums.com

          Comment


          • #6
            Yes, indeedy, Howard. Couldn't agree more. Keep 'em coming, Archie

            Comment


            • #7
              Obscure Facts About Toilets, Sewage, Rubbish, etc

              This section is one of my favorites, because it covers a range of subjects-
              Public Toilets, Sewage, & Rubbish Collection - that everybody wonders about
              but few books bother to mention. Some of what's contained here is hilariously funny.

              > For instance, a cart-driver who couldn't leave his horse & wagon but desperately needed to urinate was permitted to do so on the public street provided he hollered "In Pain! In Pain! In Pain!" before peeing!
              He was supposed to yell it 3 times so as not to offend anyone's modesty.

              > My favorite is the argument against Public Restrooms for Women: knowing that they could go out into the city streets without having to run home every time they needed to pee was seriously opposed on the grounds that
              "It would encourage ladies to wander!" lol

              I love it! I picture hordes of Victorian ladies, wandering the streets in uncontrollable numbers, emboldened by the knowledge that if it became necessary, they could pee...

              but I guess you really couldn't go very far if there weren't any decent public bathrooms. The first public restroom for women London was only built in 1900.

              LINK: Water, Public Toilets, Sewage, Rubbish Collection, Street Sweepers, etc:

              http://www.igg.org.uk/gansg/00-app1/water.htm

              Here's a pic of an early Public Urinal and one of a cast-iron Gents.



              >

              Comment


              • #8
                Thanks, Sam & How!

                Glad you like 'em... I have lots more where that came from.

                I love to read and I'm always curious, so if I happen to land on something interesting that I don't know about,
                I just follow it... As a result, while I'm doing research I constantly go off on weird tangents, but I find a lot of nuggets that way, so I gave up trying to reform.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Oops... I Neverminded the Bollards!

                  >> How could I forget the BOLLARDS??? lol, I actually did.

                  Scroll about half-way down this section to enter the wonderful world of bollards.

                  Road Markings, Street Furniture & Bollards:
                  http://www.igg.org.uk/gansg/00-app1/st-furn.htm

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Archaic View Post
                    ... while I was researching bollards, those upright metal posts which serve to block traffic.
                    As Rob Clack is well aware of my fascination with Victorian London's political geography, he has been so kind as to photograph any parochial or municipal boundary marks, as well as any bollards bearing a parochial or municipal 'label', that he happens to come across during his excursions 'round the metropolis.


                    Figure 1: Southwest Corner of Hanbury Street / Brick Lane, Parish of Christ Church Spitalfields (Click to View in flickr)
                    Courtesy of Robert Clack


                    Figure 2: Southwest Corner of Hanbury Street / Brick Lane, Parish of Christ Church Spitalfields (Click to View in flickr)
                    Courtesy of Robert Clack

                    CHT CH
                    MIDDX
                    1819

                    i.e. Christ Church, Middlesex, 1819

                    The bollard was placed by the Parish Vestry of Christ Church Spitalfields, in 1819.

                    Bollards were sometimes used as parochial or municipal boundary marks. While a portion of Brick Lane coincided with the boundary that separated the parishes of Christ Church Spitalfields and St. Mary Whitechapel; and another portion coincided with the boundary that separated the parishes of Christ Church Spitalfields and St. Matthew Bethnal Green; this particular bollard was not a boundary marker, as there was no parochial or municipal boundary in its vicinity.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Captured Cannon Bollards

                      Hi, Colin, thanks for posting Rob's photos.

                      I'm curious about the origins of bollards.

                      Do you know if they began as a way to display captured cannon and put it to good use, or if that same shape
                      (a slightly tapering cylinder) was already in use and someone got the bright idea to adapt captured enemy cannon as bollards?

                      And I wonder if you might know whether any "captured-cannon bollards" still remain?

                      Thanks!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Archaic View Post
                        I found this wonderful website one day while I was researching bollards, those upright metal posts which serve to block traffic. London is full of them, but they are quite rare in America. Apparently after the defeat of Napoleon, his captured cannon were actually pressed into service as ordinary street bollards... I'd love to know if any remain. (I doubt it)
                        Old cannons used to be in regular use as bollards in seaports and near the docks, usually stuck in the cobbles at an angle like a drunken sailor, but you are probably correct, not so much any more I think--hopefully some may have been preserved for museums but others might also have been nabbed for scrap iron during the Second World War, conceivably. There is a thread on the Yo! Liverpool Forum on Very Old Bollards. Enjoy.

                        Chris
                        Christopher T. George, Lyricist & Co-Author, "Jack the Musical"
                        https://www.facebook.com/JackTheMusical/ Hear sample song at https://tinyurl.com/y8h4envx.

                        Organizer, RipperCon #JacktheRipper-#True Crime Conferences, April 2016 and 2018.
                        Hear RipperCon 2016 & 2018 talks at http://www.casebook.org/podcast/.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Archaic View Post
                          Hi, Colin, thanks for posting Rob's photos.

                          I'm curious about the origins of bollards.

                          Do you know if they began as a way to display captured cannon and put it to good use, or if that same shape
                          (a slightly tapering metal cylinder) was already in use and someone got the bright idea to adapt captured enemy cannon as bollards?

                          And I wonder if you might know whether any "captured-cannon bollards" still remain?

                          Thanks!
                          This Flickr search shows that there are still some old cannon bollards around:

                          http://www.flickr.com/search/?w=all&...ollards&m=text

                          Chris
                          Christopher T. George, Lyricist & Co-Author, "Jack the Musical"
                          https://www.facebook.com/JackTheMusical/ Hear sample song at https://tinyurl.com/y8h4envx.

                          Organizer, RipperCon #JacktheRipper-#True Crime Conferences, April 2016 and 2018.
                          Hear RipperCon 2016 & 2018 talks at http://www.casebook.org/podcast/.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Nice Bollards

                            Hi, Chris; thanks for the links. I looked at the Liverpool & Flickr sites and here are a few photos I really liked:

                            A poor abused bollard in Liverpool...
                            Where is the 'Society For the Prevention of Cruelty To Bollards' when you need it?





                            A super cool cannon bollard complete with cannon-ball, rusted to perfection:




                            End of a long day for this hard-working bollard (either that or it's holding up the building, lol):

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              This one is interesting... it almost looks like it's made from an early howitzer!

                              What do you guys think?

                              Comment

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