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**Tom_Wescott** · May 27, 2012, 09:10 PM

Great stuff, Chris. I've no doubt you'll find him after 1901 one of these days. Bachert. Just adding this so this thread will come up in future searches of that variation.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

**Howard Brown** · May 27, 2012, 09:17 PM

Chris;

The resident genealogist/census maven over here (Nina) tried to locate him for an hour and couldn't crack it,buddy.
I've dispatched her to the grill to make steaks....but I'm sure she'll give it another crack soon.

**Robert Linford** · May 27, 2012, 11:09 PM

Hi Chris

Albert's brother-in-law might prove elusive. According to the baptism of Annie Maud in 1901, he was a ship's cook.

**Paul** · May 28, 2012, 06:50 AM

I've wondered whether that's really our Albert Bachert listed there as Albert Becker? Bachert's age fluctuates a bit over the census entries, but in this instance he would be claiming an age that would put his birth in 1875, when the reality is that he was born in 1863. A 12 year discrepancy is hardly likely to be an accident and there is no question that the age can be misread. Bachert would have been 38; can he really be claiming to be 25?

Paul

**Paul** · May 28, 2012, 06:55 AM

By the way, West Ham placed many of its poor law children in 'scattered homes ' - homes where a group of children were looked after by a house-parent and attended local schools. By 1913, the union had scattered homes at 31 and 31B, 96, 98, 100, 102 Ferndale Road, Leytonstone. 102 is the address listed for the children.

**Chris Scott** · May 28, 2012, 10:13 AM

Originally posted by Paul

I've wondered whether that's really our Albert Bachert listed there as Albert Becker? Bachert's age fluctuates a bit over the census entries, but in this instance he would be claiming an age that would put his birth in 1875, when the reality is that he was born in 1863. A 12 year discrepancy is hardly likely to be an accident and there is no question that the age can be misread. Bachert would have been 38; can he really be claiming to be 25?

Paul

Hi Paul
I had doubts along these lines but quickly found that in Albert's case the records of his age are almost worthless. This was my comment in the "Cast of Thousands":
The question of Albert's date of birth and age is not an easy one to resolve. In the 1871 data his age is given as 8 years of age, which would place his birth in or around 1863. However, I have checked the BMD registers for the period 1860 to 1865 and the only possible entry that could refer to him is the record of a William Albert Bachert, whose birth was registered in Whitechapel in the last quarter of 1860. If this is indeed the Albert Backert under discussion, then his actual age at the time of the 1871 census would have been 10 years old.
However, the extraordinary nature of the ages recorded for Backert in successive censuses make this two-year discrepancy seem positively trivial. In 1871 he is recorded as 8 years old, in 1881 he is 18 years old, in 1891 he is 22 years old and in 1901 his age is given as 26! I have in the course of my researches seen some wildly varied ages given over the course of different returns for what is undoubtedly the same individual, but this is probably the most extreme example I have encountered.

The other circumstances, apart from the age, convince me that this is Albert Backert in 1901. We know he had a sister named Flora who married a man named Robert Charles Steffen in 1894. So if this is not Albert Backert living in Sidney Street in 1901 we need to account for an extraordinary set of coincidences:
- A man named Albert Becker, a reasonable approximation to the name Albert Bachert/Backert especially in the case of a man who is known to be referenced under a huge range of variant renderings of his surname
- A sister named Flora with the very unusual married surname Steffen
- The profession of engraver which we know was Albert's trade.
I think the features which resonate with what we know of Albert outweigh the one feature, his age, which we know from other records varied wildly anyway.

**Paul** · May 28, 2012, 11:13 AM

I must admit that I am dubious whether the William Albert Bachert born on 16 September 1860 and who appears in the 1861 census as 8-month old WIlliam Bakart is the same person as Albert Bachert who appears in the 1871 census as 8 years old (born 1863). In 1881 he is listed as 18 (born 1863).

Then things start to go wrong. In 1889 the Ipswich Journal, gives Bachert's age as 21 (born 1868) and the 1891 Census confirms that he’s giving this age as it lists him as Albert Bachert. 22 years old (born 1869)

Turning to his name, various newspapers call him A.E. Beckart or Albert E Barkert, but as they refer to his involvement with Vigiliance Committee it is clearly our man and in the 1893 Electoral Register he is listed as Albert Edward Bachert, giving his address as Newnham Street and father as John, so we can identify him as the same man. I therefore think that we have grounds for thinking that he was not the William Albert Bachert of 1860, although I cannot find the death of anyone so named.

1901 sees us with Albert claiming to be 26 (birth 1875). An Albert E Beckert died in Ilford, Essex, in 1960. He was 84 years old, so would have been born c.1876. If he was our Albert, he'd be 97.

So Albert - vanity be thy friend - Bachert would appear to have be a Peter Pan syndrome who never really wanted to be out of his 20s!

**Chris Scott** · May 28, 2012, 11:20 AM

The Steffen children:-
Baptism record for Annie Maud Steffen
(Thanks to Robert Linford)
St Philip's, Stepney
When born: 13 March 1901
Christian Names: Annie Maud
Parents' Christian names: Robert and Florence
Surname: Steffen
Abode: 42 Sidney Street
Father's trade: Ship's cook
Baptized: 21 Feb 1901

George Steffen
Birth registered last quarter of 1896 - St Giles London

Possible:
Rosa Daisy Steffen
Birth registered last quarter 1899 - Shoreditch, London

From School Admissions register for Rutland Street School, Tower Hamlets
Robert Steffan (sic)
Admission Number: 354
Date of admission: 21 Jan 1901
Name in full: Steffan, Robert
Name of parent: Blank
Address: 42 Sidney Street
Date of birth: 25 Nov 1895

George Steffan (sic)
Admission Number: 384
Date of admission: Blank
Name in full: Steffan, George
Name of parent: Robert
Address: 42 Sidney Street
Date of birth: 29 Oct 1896

**Paul** · May 28, 2012, 01:36 PM

1919, Jul-Sep MARRIAGE
A Robert Staffen married Maggie Davies in Pontardawe

1970, Jan-Mar DEATH
A Robert Staffen died Jan-Mar 1970. He was born on 25 November 1894.

**Chris Scott** · May 28, 2012, 02:03 PM

Two very useful records Paul and yet another alternative spelling!
Were this family incapable of spelling a word the same way twice??!!
So it looks as though Robert Jnr (who, if the 1901 identification IS correct, was Albert Backert's nephew) stayed in Wales. The death record from 1970 which Paul posted was registered in Swansea.
Many thanks Paul.

**Chris Scott** · May 28, 2012, 02:06 PM

My apologies in that I mistranscribed the school admission for Robert Steffan (sic). The death record listed by Paul gave his date of birth as 25 Nov 1894. The school record I posted should have had the same date.
Here is the extract from the school register:
Name: Robert Steffan
Age: 6
Birth Date: 25 Nov 1894
School: Rutland Street School
Borough: Tower Hamlets
Admission Date: 21 Jan 1901
Parent: Steffan
Notes: Rutland Street School (0675) opened in 1885. Renamed Rutland School in 1938
Reference Number: LCC/EO/DIV05/RUT/AD/002

You can see an image of the Rutland Street, Whitechapel School at

Education | Historic England

http://www.heritage-explorer.co.uk/web/he/searchdetail.aspx?id=3629&crit=board

Find out about our inspiring education and work experience resources for pupils and teachers to learn about their local and national heritage.

**Debra Arif** · May 28, 2012, 11:42 PM

Originally posted by Paul

I must admit that I am dubious whether the William Albert Bachert born on 16 September 1860 and who appears in the 1861 census as 8-month old WIlliam Bakart is the same person as Albert Bachert who appears in the 1871 census as 8 years old (born 1863). !

Hi Paul, in that case, I think Wilhelm Albert must have died and Albert Edward came afterwards? They have the same parents don't they? John and Georgina...and variations of..

**Paul** · May 29, 2012, 07:55 AM

Originally posted by Debra Arif

Hi Paul, in that case, I think Wilhelm Albert must have died and Albert Edward came afterwards? They have the same parents don't they? John and Georgina...and variations of..

Hi Debs,
Yes, they have the same parents, it is the same family, I am just inclined to suggest that William Albert and Albert were different people, albeit that no death seems recorded for the former, and the three year difference in their birth years isn't one of those discrepancies we so often encounter. Problems with Albert's year of birth therefore begin later.

Augusta in the 1881 census is also quite an interesting social elevation.

Paul

**Debra Arif** · May 29, 2012, 08:38 AM

Originally posted by Paul

Hi Debs,
Yes, they have the same parents, it is the same family, I am just inclined to suggest that William Albert and Albert were different people, albeit that no death seems recorded for the former, and the three year difference in their birth years isn't one of those discrepancies we so often encounter. Problems with Albert's year of birth therefore begin later.

Augusta in the 1881 census is also quite an interesting social elevation.

Paul

Hi Paul,
I think this is probably Wilhelm's death record? He was baptised Wilhelm, too.

Deaths Sep 1861
Bockert Wilhelm Albert St. Geo. East 1c 283

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Albert Backert - The Steffens/Stiffens family in and after 1901

Albert Backert - The Steffens/Stiffens family in and after 1901

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