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  • #16
    Originally posted by Anna Morris View Post

    Unless under the floorboards was once easily accessible, then putting the diary there and nailing it in would guarantee the diary would be more of a time capsule.

    Just some thoughts.
    As you may have seen me say before I lived on Aigburth Hall Avenue in Liverpool up the street from where the Maybricks once lived. Now, when I was there in the Sixties, I kept an old photo album under the floorboards below my bed. True bill. The floorboard was loose. It wasn't nailed down. The photo album contained risqué photographs dating back to the Victorian era.
    Christopher T. George, Lyricist & Co-Author, "Jack the Musical"
    https://www.facebook.com/JackTheMusical/ Hear sample song at https://tinyurl.com/y8h4envx.

    Organizer, RipperCon #JacktheRipper-#True Crime Conferences, April 2016 and 2018.
    Hear RipperCon 2016 & 2018 talks at http://www.casebook.org/podcast/.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Chris G. View Post
      As you may have seen me say before I lived on Aigburth Hall Avenue in Liverpool up the street from where the Maybricks once lived. Now, when I was there in the Sixties, I kept an old photo album under the floorboards below my bed. True bill. The floorboard was loose. It wasn't nailed down. The photo album contained risqué photographs dating back to the Victorian era.
      That is interesting. There are some old construction techniques that held things together because things fit without benefit of nails. In any older construction I know of in my area, everything was nailed down hard.

      There are a number of references in various writings about hiding things under floorboards. Perhaps this is a new area to learn about for general interest. Who knows what was done before nails were readily available?
      The wickedness of the world is the dream of the plague.~~Voynich Manuscript

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Anna Morris View Post
        That is interesting. There are some old construction techniques that held things together because things fit without benefit of nails. In any older construction I know of in my area, everything was nailed down hard.

        There are a number of references in various writings about hiding things under floorboards. Perhaps this is a new area to learn about for general interest. Who knows what was done before nails were readily available?

        I should clarify that the floorboard under my bed had been nailed down but I prised it up. Naughty lad that I am. The photo album with the naughty pics had a red morocco cover to it with embossed gold lettering that said "The Royal Album." I didn't know about Prince Eddy back then. If I still had it now it might be worth a fortune.
        Christopher T. George, Lyricist & Co-Author, "Jack the Musical"
        https://www.facebook.com/JackTheMusical/ Hear sample song at https://tinyurl.com/y8h4envx.

        Organizer, RipperCon #JacktheRipper-#True Crime Conferences, April 2016 and 2018.
        Hear RipperCon 2016 & 2018 talks at http://www.casebook.org/podcast/.

        Comment


        • #19
          If MM had some involvement in the production of the diary, then I suggest that it would have been composed "offline", so to speak, before being deposited under the floor at Battlecrease. And, its NOT being a genuine diary, it was likely written more or less in one sitting, obviating the need to repeatedly lift/replace the boards every time a new entry was added.
          Kind regards, Sam Flynn

          "Suche Nullen"
          (F. Nietzsche)

          Comment


          • #20
            Without being a thread derailing git....

            If I was a person who ..

            ..had a reason to paint Sir Jim in a very bad light,
            ..had a reason to produce evidence of him being so in a hurry,
            ..had intimate knowldege of the maybricks,
            ..had access to Battlecrease,
            ..found myself with a desperate need to hide something quickly in Battlecrease
            ..was desperate enough to need to draft something as mad as the diary,

            .. I might be Florrie?

            As Anna Points out, under the floorboards seems a girlish way of hiding something? Sorry Chris G. ... no aspertions being cast on your teenage stash of Victorian porn.

            P

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            • #21
              Wouldn't MM (and/or Florence) have made more of an effort to emulate James Maybrick's handwriting?
              Kind regards, Sam Flynn

              "Suche Nullen"
              (F. Nietzsche)

              Comment


              • #22
                Depends on how much of a hurry they (Florrie?) were/was in perhaps...

                Its hard to see how anyone writing the document wouldnt have tried to copy his handwriting but there you go .... that comment is as equally valid for any modern forger as it is for any victorian/edwardian forger.

                Its a whole lot of work to go to to write out such a document in Maybricks name and NOT try to make a stab at the handwriting.

                I dont see why Florrie/Michael would have been more interested in copying his handwriting than lets say a Barrett or a Beadle.

                A main problem I have with either Florrie or Michael is that a certain Karen "Baphomet" Trenouth has posited both as probable authors and I tend to get a fairly visceral negative reaction to anything she thinks is probable.

                See here: http://victorianripper.niceboard.org...the-freemasons

                P

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by Mr. Poster View Post
                  Its hard to see how anyone writing the document wouldnt have tried to copy his handwriting but there you go .... that comment is as equally valid for any modern forger as it is for any victorian/edwardian forger
                  The main difference being that both MM and FM would certainly have known what JM's writing looked like, and would have been very familiar with it for a number of years. Time enough to practise, if they were so inclined.
                  Kind regards, Sam Flynn

                  "Suche Nullen"
                  (F. Nietzsche)

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    And Mike Barrett ... given that he had time to research pretty much every aspect of Maybricks life, then research the Ripper crimes, then obtain a suitable Victorian book in which to write his essay, then research Victorian ink and how to ensure his doodlings were up to technical muster, then draft and write/dictate the thing........ would have had plenty of time and the research experience by that point....to find an example of Maybricks writing somewhere.

                    And who knows...maybe Florrie and Michael were indeed much better aquainted with Maybricks than we are ... given that they had access to probably more than a disputed will and a letter!

                    P

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                    • #25
                      Hi All,

                      I don't know, but would MM really have wanted such a dirty pile of Maybrick family laundry to get an airing at some unknowable time in the future, if and when those floorboards came up?

                      You might loathe your brother and sister-in-law with a passion bordering on apoplexy, but would you seriously expect to come out of it well, as a major celeb of the era, when whoever discovered your carefully constructed hatchet job went public with it, regardless of how good you tried to make yourself look in the process?

                      I came at this from the opposite direction, assuming the diary would have been the very last thing on earth that a pompous, social-climbing MM would have been thrilled to think of coming out of the family woodwork.

                      But I'm open to persuasion because MM is not really my bag and I don't know nearly enough about him to argue the case against his involvement. He seemed to be a master of damage limitation - that is, damage to James's reputation as well as to his own - in the wake of Florie's arrest for murder, so I do wonder how he could have thought this diary would serve that cause, rather than damage it beyond repair.

                      The handwriting is also problematic, although to be fair you'd need to be clinically insane to write 63 pages in your own recognisable hand if you hated your brother enough to fake a ripper confession supposedly written by him.

                      Oops!

                      Love,

                      Caz
                      X
                      I wish I were two puppies then I could play together - Storm Petersen

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Very perceptive post, Caz
                        Kind regards, Sam Flynn

                        "Suche Nullen"
                        (F. Nietzsche)

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Well they say that revenge is a dish best served cold, but surely not at absolute zero? To hide the diary and then just wait for it to turn up seems very strange.


                          If he ever wanted to nudge things along, he wouldn't have been able to, without explaining how he knew it was there. If he didn't want to admit authorship his only recourse would be to say that James had told him it was there. But then he might lay himself open to the charge of withholding info relevant to Florrie's trial and to the JTR case.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Robert Linford View Post
                            But then he might lay himself open to the charge of withholding info relevant... to the JTR case.
                            On which the diarist provides a fair amount of detail. If MM was the author, he seems to have known a fair bit about the case.
                            Kind regards, Sam Flynn

                            "Suche Nullen"
                            (F. Nietzsche)

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              I think the diary was written by a male. I am sure some women of the day would have been capable of writing such harsh material but I would think women with good backgrounds would be much less likely to even be able to think along those lines.

                              What about a disgruntled servant as author? Blackmail purposes? I always thought it odd that a servant opened the letter that incriminated Florence and her lover. I thought servants were supposed to know their places or get sacked. That a servant felt comfortable reading her employer's mail and then admitting to it, implies to me the servants in the Maybrick home were anything but devoted and loyal. (Or else they were loyal to James and against Florence.)

                              Here's a general question, perhaps best posted somewhere else but I'll ask it here. I once got a real doozy of a threatening letter. Very creative and loaded with supposed hate. Take it seriously or not? The police noted that the worst lines of threat were written just like the other lines. They said when someone is angry and really means what they write, they bear down on the pen and the lines become very straight. (This does not mean they have to be straight with a line on the paper, but that the parts that are intended are written with more force and direction than general ramblings.)

                              Are any parts of the diary written more forcefully than others or is it page after page of story telling without much variation in the penmanship? (I have only seen small exemplars of the work.)
                              The wickedness of the world is the dream of the plague.~~Voynich Manuscript

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Anna Morris View Post
                                Are any parts of the diary written more forcefully than others or is it page after page of story telling without much variation in the penmanship? (I have only seen small exemplars of the work.)
                                One should be able to tell Anna as the nib on a pen splays open the harder you lean on it so forceful lines should be wider than non forceful ones.

                                P

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