Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Pizer at Crossingham's?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #31
    Hi Debs

    Having difficulty snipping the item in Paint - probably this confounded mouse. The 1884 Times item says the Home had more than 30 boys. By 1889 it had moved premises to Barnsbury Square. In 1882 a woman of 2 Palmer Place was convicted of baby farming. I'm assuming this was nothing to do with the Home but I'm also assuming that 2 Palmer Place was on the corner with Holloway Rd, so it's a bit confusing.

    Comment


    • #32
      Thanks Gareth. I'll re-find them and send them over.

      Comment


      • #33
        Welsh Translation 1

        The Banner & Times of Wales (Baner ac Amserau Cymru), July 12th 1882

        LONDON LETTER

        SATURDAY NIGHT, July 8th 1882

        WELSH LONDON (From our Special Correspondent)

        HOME FOR DESTITUTE CHILDREN

        A little time ago, a meeting was held concerning the opening of a Home for Destitute Children in 185 Holloway Road, under the directorship of Mr and Mrs H Lloyd Hughes. For some years now Mrs Hughes, possibly better known throughout Wales as Miss Megan Watts, has taken great interest in charitable works to save the young homeless nomads of North London. To begin with, she used to take them into her own home; later, she found rooms for them in the neighbourhood; and, by now, she has a large house for the purpose of taking forward her work.

        In the above-mentioned meeting, the chair was taken by Mr R.T. Paton, a supporter of the movement, and the proceedings were opened by a religious service. The children of the Home, around 20 in number, were led in by their supervisor, Mr Potter, and they sang several songs and hymns with great skill. Mrs Watts Hughes [sic] read an affecting and heartfelt account, telling how her enthusiasm for this work started many years ago at her home in Dowlais, how she started out in Station Road, and how her efforts met with success both [at Station Road] and at Swan Yard.

        The first aim of the movement, it seems, was to provide night accommodation to homeless children; however, the benefits of giving those children the chance of some work soon became apparent, and so the Shoeblack Brigade was formed. It all seemed pretty hopeless, but it should be remembered that the Saviour died for the likes of these outcasts as much as for those in happier situations. Therefore, they were reassured that they should persevere; and, since they started their work, they have helped as many as 73 abandoned children.

        After having secured the house in Holloway Road, Mrs Hughes hopes to continue to even more success. She has started a Sunday School there for the poor children of the neighbourhood, Mothers Meetings and similar services are being set up, so the home seems destined not only to benefit the needy children picked up from the streets, but as a centre of great good and usefulness in other areas.

        Mr Hughes gave an interesting description of the kinds of children taken in. For example, when one was brought in who did not know the first thing about how to wash, the supervisor had to scour him thoroughly before his skin could be seen! Another was abandoned one night by his parents, never to hear a word from them again. Yet another (the son of a famous barrister), had money put away for him ready for his 21st birthday, but who nonetheless had been forced to live in the Capital's gutters in the meantime.

        As to the nature of the work, Mr Hughes explained that the children would start as shoe-polishers or messengers, assigning them to work as wood-choppers on rainy days, etc. They could expect to earn 1s 6d each weekday, and 2s on Saturdays, but they weren't forced to reach these targets, nor were they reprimanded if they did not. They were taught to read, and other entertainments were provided. They slept in three or four purpose-built rooms, with the older children sharing responsibility as overseers. Of course, their earnings aren't anywhere near enough to keep them, so donations from friends are essential for Mr and Mrs Hughes to carry on their work.

        Several other speeches were made during the meeting, including one by Mr Simner, who referred to the pleasure that derives from trying to do good, and from trying to be of use to the world. He congratulated Mrs Hughes on her success, and hoped that many of those whom she'd saved would become pearls in the crown of Jesus. The meeting was brought to a close with a hymn.

        --- // ---

        More to follow later - Sam F.
        Kind regards, Sam Flynn

        "Suche Nullen"
        (F. Nietzsche)

        Comment


        • #34
          Thanks Gareth. I don't know about others, but I'd never heard of these people till now.

          Comment


          • #35
            Thanks Gareth.
            No. I've not heard of any of them before either, Robert.

            Comment


            • #36
              Megan Watts Hughes

              HUGHES , MEGAN WATTS (1842-1907), vocalist; b. 12 Feb. 1842 at Dowlais, Glamorgan, whither her parents had moved from Pembrokeshire and where her father became superintendent of the Dowlais cemetery. She came into prominence when quite young as a vocalist in concerts held in the Merthyr and Aberdare districts. A local committee was formed with the object of raising funds to enable her to be trained; with assistance given after the Gwent and Morgannwg musical festival of 1863, she was able to receive lessons from Miss Gedrych, Cardiff, and Mills, the organist at Llandaf Cathedral. In 1864 she went to the Royal Academy of Music, London, where she studied under Garcia. Owing to ill-health, however, she was not able to complete the course. In 1871 she m. a London bank-official named Lloyd Hughes. Mrs. Watts Hughes, as she now was, accompanied Joseph Parry on a musical tour of North Wales. She took part twice in Orpheus (Gluck); she also sang duets with Jenny Lind. Soon after her marriage she founded a home for necessitous and homeless boys. She wrote several hymn-tunes, some of which are included in Tonau, Salmau ac Anthemau (David Jenkins); of these Wilton Square continues to be popular. Her anthem called Atgyfodiad was published, and her song, Y Gwcw ar y Fedwen continued in popularity for a long time. She invented a musical device called Voice Figures, gave a demonstration of its use at a Royal Society meeting held in Burlington House, London, and wrote a booklet describing it. She d. 29 Oct. 1907 and was buried in Abney Park cemetery, London; thirty boys from her "home" were at the funeral, and Madam Mary Davies delivered an address.


              ---//---

              Source, Welsh Biography Online, which might come in handy for other purposes. Link below.

              http://wbo.llgc.org.uk/en/index.html

              On the website of the National Library of Wales... "Uncle Jack" would have been very proud
              Kind regards, Sam Flynn

              "Suche Nullen"
              (F. Nietzsche)

              Comment


              • #37
                What what what what what? No Harry? I shall write to the Times about this.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Palmer's Place - cut from my book

                  Originally posted by Rob Clack View Post
                  I just double checked and it was on the corner with Palmer Place. So definitely not there in 1894.

                  Rob
                  Palmer's Place rang a bell with me too, so I looked it up. Following is a portion cut from my book. I believe I discussed this with Debs and it was decided this woman was not Pearly Poll. But if nothing else, this tells us a little about Palmer's Place.

                  Pearly Poll had been a career criminal and prostitute for years and was possibly on occasion a police informant. There are many press reports relating to Mary Connelly’s and Mary Ann Connelly’s of various spellings, but it’s often difficult to distinguish if the subject is one and the same as Pearly Poll; likewise, she no doubt gave an alias as often as she gave her real name, so there are probably crimes and reports we’ll never associate with her. But there are two episodes, one from 1881 and the other from 1889, that I feel most likely refer to Poll as the culprit.
                  The earlier episode centered on a brothel in Palmer’s Place: a small, dark turning out of St. George’s Street. On December 22nd, a Norwegian sailor by the name of Auguste Carlson had wandered into the notorious neighborhood of the Ratcliff Highway looking to spend his money on girls and booze. He was talking with a mate when a young woman approached him and suggested they go off together. He went willingly and was led into a dark street and inside 5 Palmer’s Place; once inside he was shown into a room where sat a second woman, Mary Ann Connelly.
                  Mary asked for money for a drink, so he gave her some which she then passed to the younger woman along with the order to go buy a drink. When the young woman returned Carlson asked for his change but was informed she’d used it all on the purchase of a bottle. For the next 45 minutes they drank together and by this time Carlson was, as he put it, “three parts drunk.” Connelly asked for more money but was refused at which point the younger woman sidled up to Carlson and he noticed her hands were in his pocket, reaching for money. The rest of the story is best told in Carlson’s own words as recorded in the Old Bailey transcript:
                  “I caught hold of the pocket. The prisoner (Connelly) held me; she was on the other side of the table, about two steps off; but she ran round the table, flew at me, held me by the coat, and scratched my face. While she was struggling with me I received a cut on the back of my right hand with a knife. I was grasping the pocket at the same time—the other woman dragged the pocket out. I cannot say who inflicted the wound. I saw a long knife, I cannot say which woman had it. I lost no money; I had 7s. and some odd pence in my pocket—it remained in the pocket. I got frightened, halloed out, struck the prisoner with my fist in the eye, and ran out. I did use a knife. I made an attempt at the prisoner. When I got outside I halloed out for help; a man took hold of me, and I was taken by a policeman to the station. I was charged, I don't know what with.”
                  He was charged with assaulting Mary Ann Connelly, who was found with a small cut on her shoulder, sobbing of how she’d been attacked by a stranger. Both were remanded into custody and placed before the magistrate. Carlson was allowed out on bail but Connelly was not. The younger woman remained unnamed and was never located by police. Due to the conflicting stories and the fact that both parties received injuries (although Connelly’s was barely more than a scratch, whereas Carlson was “bleeding profusely” from his hand), neither were found guilty of a crime.
                  What’s interesting is Carlson’s portrayal of Connelly as a fierce, knife-wielding maniac. Also of note is the testimony of H Division constable, John Matheson, who attempted to remove Connelly from the brothel at 5 Palmer’s Place, but was “ordered out by a prostitute who presumes to be the landlady”. In spite of his legal authority, he actually vacated the premises and waited to arrest Connelly the next morning at police court when she arrived to press charges against Carlson. He found Carlson’s knife 50 yards from the scene of the crime where Connelly or her partner apparently planted it to make it look as though Carlson had abandoned the knife upon fleeing. Predictably, Connelly denied all charges, ridiculously claiming,” I did not rob him. I did not put my hand nigh him. The sergeant in the court knows me as a hard-working woman.”

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Islington?

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Edward Stow View Post
                      There's a danger in not discussing things first as you can convince yourself of things - that is evident in Tom's book I fear.
                      Yes, because of the two of us, I'm the one known for convincing myself of things.

                      Originally posted by Edward Stow
                      But on the face if it this is extra evidence that Pizer was indeed that pervy Leather Apron.
                      Hardly that. But it might be another piece in the puzzle. After all, there's a reason that Pizer and not some other schlupp was being fitted up by Thick and company.

                      Excellent work, Debs, and extremely astute observations in follow up from Rob Clack.

                      Yours truly,

                      Tom Wescott

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Different Palmers Place, Tom.

                        Rob

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Rob Clack View Post
                          Different Palmers Place, Tom.

                          Rob
                          Thanks, Rob. But so I know, how is it you're able to tell?

                          Yours truly,

                          Tom Wescott

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            It's not Islington

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Tom_Wescott View Post
                              Thanks, Rob. But so I know, how is it you're able to tell?

                              Yours truly,

                              Tom Wescott
                              I presume you got the report from The Illustrated Police News?
                              The report said 5 Palmer's Place, St George's. Which is East London and was roughly North of Wapping and took in Pinchin Street and Berner Street. Don't know the exact location. Will try and have a look. It's a bit of a distance to Holloway which as Debs said would be Islington.

                              Rob

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Rob Clack View Post
                                I presume you got the report from The Illustrated Police News?
                                The report said 5 Palmer's Place, St George's. Which is East London and was roughly North of Wapping and took in Pinchin Street and Berner Street. Don't know the exact location. Will try and have a look. It's a bit of a distance to Holloway which as Debs said would be Islington.

                                Rob
                                Plus she was ten years too old (from the PP we researchers tend to think is the right one and not the A to Z identificaion) and all sorts of things went against her..but I explained all this at the time.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X