Who Was the Body in the Thames?

[Sean Crundall]

Hi Debs,

Very, very interesting.

This man could well be the supposed drowned man alluded to by Bachert which, of course, means that identifying him and determining his antecedents is imperative. A possible new suspect! Could he also be the drowned man mentioned by Edwin T. Woodhall? Admittedly, Woodhall places his suicide near the Hungerford Bridge.

Excellent research, Debs, but then I've come to expect nothing less of you.

I'm away for Christmas (20th-27th) and will message you on my return.

Hope you have a great Christmas.

My very best wishes,

Sean X X.

[Debra Arif]

Hi Debs,

Very, very interesting.

This man could well be the supposed drowned man alluded to by Bachert which, of course, means that identifying him and determining his antecedents is imperative. A possible new suspect! Could he also be the drowned man mentioned by Edwin T. Woodhall? Admittedly, Woodhall places his suicide near the Hungerford Bridge.

Excellent research, Debs, but then I've come to expect nothing less of you.

I'm away for Christmas (20th-27th) and will message you on my return.

Hope you have a great Christmas.

My very best wishes,

Sean X X.

Hi Sean.

Thanks for your kind words.

As you can see, it only took me seven years to get around to following up on the initial newspaper report I found. Perhaps an ID can be made in time for the 150th anniversary!

Ever the optimist, I do think it possible he can be traced through army records but not without a lot of effort or a lucky break.

Hope you have a wonderful Christmas too. I'll look forward to hearing from you when you get back.

Debs xx

[Tammy Green]

This was one of the most interesting threads I've ever read ! Most appreciated!

Thank You everyone for sharig!

Tammy

[Paradox]

Personally ( and I feel quite strongly about this ) the only thing that still confounds me about Druitt's suicide is the fact that he did so simply by putting rocks in his coat pockets and letting himself drown . Not that that is strange by itself per se , but as most of you probably know , Druitt was a strong swimmer . My personal ( but probably already suggested theory ) is that Druitt gave himself a " relaxing " drug that allowed him to " loosen up " while remaining in general control of his thoughts . A paralytic drug in short , but were he timed the intake . This seems to me a very strange way to kill yourself , but perhaps drowning held some kind of symbolic meaning for Druitt personally which we have been unable to discover .







- Paradox

[Robert Linford]

Everyone write out one hundred times "Whose was the body in the Thames?"


Regards


MJ Druitt (deceased)

[Gary Barnett]

Everyone write out one hundred times "Whose was the body in the Thames?"


Regards


MJ Druitt (deceased)

If William Hartnell had thrown himself into the river, it would have been 'Who's was the body in the Thames.'

[Robert Linford]

Very clever. And if Polly Nichols had been thrown in the Thames, Fish would have written "Whose ooze came from the body in the Thames?"

[Gary Barnett]

Am I odd for finding Debs's unidentified one-eyed deserter a hundred times more interesting than Monty D?

[Gary Barnett]

Personally ( and I feel quite strongly about this ) the only thing that still confounds me about Druitt's suicide is the fact that he did so simply by putting rocks in his coat pockets and letting himself drown . Not that that is strange by itself per se , but as most of you probably know , Druitt was a strong swimmer . My personal ( but probably already suggested theory ) is that Druitt gave himself a " relaxing " drug that allowed him to " loosen up " while remaining in general control of his thoughts . A paralytic drug in short , but were he timed the intake . This seems to me a very strange way to kill yourself , but perhaps drowning held some kind of symbolic meaning for Druitt personally which we have been unable to discover .







- Paradox

The PLA does not recommend swimming in the tidal Thames - even without stones in your pockets.

https://www.pla.co.uk/Safety/Swimmin...e-Tidal-Thames

[Paradox]

The PLA does not recommend swimming in the tidal Thames - even without stones in your pockets.

https://www.pla.co.uk/Safety/Swimmin...e-Tidal-Thames

Yeah I know , but that wasn't exactly the point I was trying to prove . My point was that suicide by drowning seems a little odd when one is a strong swimmer .

[Gary Barnett]

Yeah I know , but that wasn't exactly the point I was trying to prove . My point was that suicide by drowning seems a little odd when one is a strong swimmer .

Not if one knows the tidal Thames is particularly treacherous and makes sure of the job by filling one's pockets full of rocks. Also, perhaps the mentality of a would-be suicide discounts the possibility of a last minute change of heart.

[Anna Morris]

I never understood the rocks in the pockets either but while I pondered this over the years I did find other cases of suicidal drowning with rocks in the pockets. Perhaps that was in hopes the body would sink into the water and not be found since suicide was extremely immoral and was hurtful to family. Perhaps that was the reason for rocks rather than as an instrument of drowning.

Although, if someone jumped into the river from a bridge or something, perhaps the rocks would keep the person down long enough to drown before surfacing.

I sort of figured with Monty that he depended on the cold water to do at least part of the work. It is always said that if a person falls off a boat into the Pacific Ocean up north here that the cold water will kill them before they can drown. The same has been said of falling into some of our bigger rivers in the winter.

Something we do not know about Druitt and his family is if they could have had some medical condition(s) for which they self medicated. Perhaps the mental issues could have been brought on by laudanum for pain or even some prescribed yet dangerous drug taken frequently. Perhaps he was medicated when he entered the water.

[Robert Linford]

It can happen - I think Virginia Woolf was one such (swimmer I mean).

[Gary Barnett]

Here's what the PLA has to say.

Danger for swimmers:

Powerful tides, running at around five miles an hour, will overpower even the strongest swimmers.

Eddies and undertows - caused by the uneven river bed, bridge pillars, piers and moored vessels – will suck swimmers under in seconds and keep them below the surface for days. No safety precautions can counter these lethal currents – surviving them is a simply matter of luck.

Bitingly cold river water will cripple the most accomplished swimmers and cause involuntary breathing spasms – known as a ‘gasp reflex’ – when a person is temporarily submerged.

If Druitt had jumped into the upper reaches of the Thames on a sunny August day, stripped to his undercrackers and sans ballast, that would have been a very odd suicide attempt.

[Paradox]

Of course ! The cold .. how could I forget . I suppose the nature of the suicide simply feels odd , but then again I may have been reading to many of the " Druitt was a cover-up " stories . I still stand behind the other part of my theory that he could have given himself a paralytic , as to not completely feel the bitter coldness of the water in some way . The thing I'd really want to know is how big the stones in his pockets were . I must say I didn't completely know that the tides were so rigorous in the Thames , will keep that in mind next time . In the end I do think that he was mentally unstable , but more depressed than truly insane .