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  • Originally posted by Jose Oranto View Post


    Gary, this makes me think... remember when I went looking for Biddy the Chiver's grave in June? The information you gave me was 11b, but 11b was a private graves area. It may have been that the same square contained private graves and common graves, but at StCRC this seems highly unlikely, as it has large squares intended specifically for common graves. The grave in the photo is the one that located at Row 44 grave 19; Chiver's burial decade and that of this grave coincide, therefore there must be something wrong.
    According to this map I found online https://victorianwhitechapel.tumblr....ks-rc-cemetery, there are three '11' areas at St Patrick's: 11a [not sure if it says 'A'], 11b and 11 (I don't know if it says just 11 or something else). 11a [?] and 11b, are clearly private grave squares, 11 being a common grave square, in which Pearly Poll is buried. I was wondering if, perhaps, Chiver is also buried in that square, it seems the most logical, although it is evident that you could not imagine a 'b' when they told you the location.
    That’s odd, Jose. When I called them I enquired about two burials: Biddy’s was in 1935 and the other was a family one in 1929. In both cases, I wrote down plot 11b. Both had been burials from workhouse infirmaries, Shoreditch for Biddy and STGITE for the family member.

    As you say, it seems unlikely I’d have written ‘b’ if they hadn’t said it.

    If we can’t work it out, I’ll give them another call. The man I spoke to was very helpful.

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    • Originally posted by Gary Barnett View Post

      That’s odd, Jose. When I called them I enquired about two burials: Biddy’s was in 1935 and the other was a family one in 1929. In both cases, I wrote down plot 11b. Both had been burials from workhouse infirmaries, Shoreditch for Biddy and STGITE for the family member.

      As you say, it seems unlikely I’d have written ‘b’ if they hadn’t said it.

      If we can’t work it out, I’ll give them another call. The man I spoke to was very helpful.

      ​​​​​​I am thinking that it could be that the map is wrong and that plot 11b is the one immediately below 11a. When I pass by there I'll try to get a map.

      And yes, that gentlemen is very kind

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      • Originally posted by Jose Oranto View Post


        ​​​​​​I am thinking that it could be that the map is wrong and that plot 11b is the one immediately below 11a. When I pass by there I'll try to get a map.

        And yes, that gentlemen is very kind
        Thanks, Jose. You too are very helpful!

        It would be nice to know where Biddy is buried.

        I’ve not really paid too much attention to grave sites until recently, but your and Rob’s obvious expertise in tracking them down has inspired me somewhat.

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        • Originally posted by Gary Barnett View Post

          Thanks, Jose. You too are very helpful!

          It would be nice to know where Biddy is buried.

          I’ve not really paid too much attention to grave sites until recently, but your and Rob’s obvious expertise in tracking them down has inspired me somewhat.
          Thank you Gary.

          ​​​​​​'Graves' I know is not a very popular subject, but for me it is, perhaps, the most important... what is buried is the only thing that still 'exists'. I feel like it's the ‘closest one can get to history'.

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          • Adelaide Springett


            I was looking for Adelaide's grave. She passed away aged 93. Buried at Kensal Green Cemetery on 4th September 1896. Grave number 33187


            Photography and text: https://spitalfieldslife.com/2020/03...ields-nippers/

            Adelaide Springett was born in February 1893 in the parish of St George-in-the-East, Wapping. Her father, William Springett came from Marylebone and her mother Margaret from St Lukes, Old St. Both parents were costermongers, although William was a dock labourer when he first married. Adelaide’s twin sisters, Ellen and Margaret, died at birth and another sister, Susannah, died aged four. Adelaide attended St Mary’s School and then St Joseph’s School. The addresses on her school admissions were 12 Miller’s Court, Dorset St, and then 26 Dorset St. In 1901, at eight years old, she was recorded as lodging with her mother at the Salvation Army Shelter in Hanbury St.


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            • I really enjoyed reading GRAPPLING WITH HISTORY 'Where Did You Go, Hezekiah Moscow? The Life and Times of Ching Hook'. (https://grapplingwithhistory.com/201...zekiah-moscow/)

              I followed the link (above) that Sean shared on casebook, in a fabulous thread about the Gehringers (https://forum.casebook.org/forum/ripper-discussions/general-discussion/701863-frederick-gehringer-barrow-lender-lodging-house-keeper-and-crime-lord/page2)

              Chapter 2 tells the death of Alec Munroe, a boxer and friend of Ching Ghook. Two days after Munroe's burial, Hook had a match at the Blue Anchor, Shoreditch. Before leaving the ring, he thanked his friends for their sympathy for him and assuring them he had carried out Munroe's funeral arrangements to the best of his ability.

              The author cites the date of the funeral and the cemetery (Ilford Cemetery). I couldn't resist knowing where he was buried.

              He was buried in Manor Park Cemetery. Unfortunately it is no longer possible to pinpoint where it is, but the square is unusually so small that we could know where it is with a relatively small margin of error. Mrs. Fiddymont's baby and Annie Chapman were buried in the next squares.

              The record says square 157 (today it is square M), just entering the cemetery through the back door, on the left hand side.
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              • George Robert Sims

                Golders Green's​​​​​​ columbaria
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                • Lewis Carroll
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