Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Ripperologist: September 2009 Issue # 106

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Howard Brown
    replied
    Moving right along...

    Apologies to Mr. Simon Wood for not starting a discussion of his recent article in this issue yesterday...."Smoke & Mirrors"...Simon's presentation of material ( numerous newspaper articles from a variety of sources) which support his view that the trip undertaken by Inspector Walter Andrews to the North American continent following Francis Tumblety's trip to the United States was not an effort to apprehend the quack....not only for homosexual offenses or Tumblety's possible culpability as the Whitechapel Murderer , but essentially a smoke screen, in Mr. Wood's termininolgy, in order to serve other Crown interests and purposes.

    In essence, Simon proposes that we should treat the candidacy of Tumblety with "caution", in light of his presentation of materials which make for good reading.

    If one of the several big guns who do research on Tumbelty and who are members of the Forums would care to carry this conversation further along, I think that would be the best of all possible worlds. Certainly, Tumbelty researchers are in the upper echelon of fact based researchers in Ripperology ( Riordan.Vanderlinden,Chetcuti,Palmer, and of course, SPE)...so it might be best if we let one of these gentleman carry the ball....unless someone else would kindly care to provide an opening question for the rest of the readers.

    Thank you.

    Leave a comment:


  • Adam Wood
    replied
    Scott,

    Thanks for pointing out that mistake, as it gives me the chance to rectify it. We obviously had a brain freeze composing that sentence, which should have included R J Palmer and Joe Chetcuti rather than yourself.

    We didn't even mention the Tumblety article by Simon Wood in the same issue!

    We greatly appreciate the opportunity to publish the excellent research by Joe and RJ; apologies to all concerned. Look out for an article from Joe in the coming months!

    Best wishes
    Adam

    Leave a comment:


  • Howard Brown
    replied
    Scott:

    If you get a chance...please let me know whether the possibility of Anderson being told the details of the Identification from Swanson and not the other way around as it is usually presumed to be....would make a difference to you and why...if you aren't too burned out from the vacation.

    Thanks.
    Last edited by Howard Brown; September 10, 2009, 10:10 PM. Reason: it would help if I spelled Identification correctly....

    Leave a comment:


  • Scott Nelson
    replied
    Can I switch the emphasis a little just for sake of clarification? (just returned from a lengthy vacation, so sorry for not seeing this earlier).

    On page 88 of this issue, under the heading, "Classics", subheading "The Book", a re-review of the classic "The Lodger" by Stewart Evans and Paul Gainey, it is written that I contributed follow-up research into Tumblety with Wolf Vanderlinden, Carmen Cumming and Timothy Riordan. This is a mistake' as the author clearly meant Joe Chetcuti, not me. Joe, as Stewart and others will attest to, is one of the most pre-eminent researchers on Tumblety. Joe and I are good friends, so maybe that's the source of the confusion. ----just to set the record straight....

    Leave a comment:


  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    Early Crime Booklets & The Newgate Calendar

    Originally posted by SPE View Post
    It's a reproduction from a book, I do have some great images of the Ratcliff Highway murders from an 1812 booklet on the murders.
    Hi, Stewart. Is your 1812 booklet of the type they called "chap-books"? Wow, that's really an oldie.

    In case you're interested, I posted some pages from the 18th C.
    "Newgate Calendar, Or Villainy Displayed In All Its Branches" on the Bedlam thread.

    There is a also link to the whole Newgate Calendar online, complete with original illustrations. It contains the stories of famous criminals, crimes & hangings... plenty of 'blood & thunder'.

    Here's the Bedlam page, it's in Post #11: http://www.jtrforums.com/showthread.php?t=7317&page=5

    Leave a comment:


  • SPE
    replied
    Emanuel Delbast Violenia

    Apropos of Pizer and the 'Leather Apron' 'scare' it is interesting to note that in October 1888 someone even suggested that Violenia might be the murderer.

    Leave a comment:


  • SPE
    replied
    Reproduction

    Originally posted by Archaic View Post
    That's a fabulous poster, Stewart; I've never seen it before.
    Do you mind if I ask if that one is an original or a reproduction?
    It's a reproduction from a book, I do have some great images of the Ratcliff Highway murders from an 1812 booklet on the murders.

    Leave a comment:


  • SPE
    replied
    George R Sims

    Sims also majored on the 'Leather Apron' scare, this in The Referee of September 16, 1888 -

    Leave a comment:


  • SPE
    replied
    The Referee

    George R. Sims in his 'Mustard and Cress' column in The Referee made an early reference to the Ratcliff Highway murders in his coverage of the Whitechapel murders on September 9, 1888 -

    Leave a comment:


  • Howard Brown
    replied
    But I think it's interesting to note that the source of this particular "De Quincey's 'Leathern Apron'" confusion appears to be Vance Thompson rather than Harry Dam, because it is Thompson who claims this supposed literary reference is what inspired Dam to create a Whitechapel character known as 'Leather Apron'.--Archaic

    Good eye,Archaic...if I may say so.


    Leave a comment:


  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    Horrid Murder

    That's a fabulous poster, Stewart; I've never seen it before.

    Do you mind if I ask if that one is an original or a reproduction?

    Leave a comment:


  • SPE
    replied
    Ratcliff Highway Murders

    De Quincey, book version and Ratcliff Highway Murders poster -


    Leave a comment:


  • Chris G.
    replied
    Originally posted by SPE View Post
    Yes, I am, but I was going to do a bit more research on it before I was happy to voice my opinion. I do feel this must be the origin of the reference.

    I think that the 'Leathern Apron' and 'Jewish' elements are merely add-ons to the story to give it better connectivity to the Whitechapel murders. In true crime circles 'On Murder Considered as One of the Fine Arts' is something of a much-quoted classic, especially in the press. The details of the earlier (1811) Ratcliff Highway murders were given in articles on the Whitechapel murders in 1888.

    De Quincey's name popped up in connection with the Whitechapel murders, in 1888, The Times editorial of September 10, 1888 - "The mind travels back to the pages of DE QUINCEY for an equal display of scientific delight in the details of butchery..." being an example. The essay on the Ratcliff Highway murders detailed the East End murders of 1811 and described the murderer.

    All this, the location, the published 1888 linking of De Quincey, the Ratcliff Highway murders and the Whitechapel murders, combined with the odd blackened eyebrows reference take it, in my opinion, beyond coincidence. Just a touch of authorial license added.
    You could be right. I appreciate this additional information tying De Quincey to literature on the Whitechapel murders as well as the East End murders of 77 years earlier.

    All the best

    Chris

    Leave a comment:


  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    Originally posted by SPE View Post
    All in all, it appears to me to be another example of the press making up stories and using partly factual references to do so. This indeed seems very likely in view of source.
    Hi, Stewart; I agree with you here.

    I can't think of a reference in any of De Quincey's writing to a 'leathern-aproned' Jew.

    He did write about Jews; I remember one passage in particular in which De Quincey states that Jews use "un-notched" knives in their rituals for religious reasons.

    And De Quincey did mention leather aprons in another work, but it was in reference to the
    white leather aprons worn by Masons.

    This does sound like a half-remembered mish-mash of literary influences and popular rumor.

    But I think it's interesting to note that the source of this particular "De Quincey's 'Leathern Apron'" confusion appears to be Vance Thompson rather than Harry Dam, because it is Thompson who claims this supposed literary reference is what inspired Dam to create a Whitechapel character known as 'Leather Apron'.

    Leave a comment:


  • SPE
    replied
    On Murder Considered as One of the Fine Arts

    Originally posted by Chris G. View Post
    Agreed
    Hi Stewart
    Then it sounds as if you are talking about Thomas De Quincey's essay on the Ratcliffe Highway murders, which I knew about but rejected as the origin of the story since it seemed to lack the Jewish element.
    All the best
    Chris
    Yes, I am, but I was going to do a bit more research on it before I was happy to voice my opinion. I do feel this must be the origin of the reference.

    I think that the 'Leathern Apron' and 'Jewish' elements are merely add-ons to the story to give it better connectivity to the Whitechapel murders. In true crime circles 'On Murder Considered as One of the Fine Arts' is something of a much-quoted classic, especially in the press. The details of the earlier (1811) Ratcliff Highway murders were given in articles on the Whitechapel murders in 1888.

    De Quincey's name popped up in connection with the Whitechapel murders, in 1888, The Times editorial of September 10, 1888 - "The mind travels back to the pages of DE QUINCEY for an equal display of scientific delight in the details of butchery..." being an example. The essay on the Ratcliff Highway murders detailed the East End murders of 1811 and described the murderer.

    All this, the location, the published 1888 linking of De Quincey, the Ratcliff Highway murders and the Whitechapel murders, combined with the odd blackened eyebrows reference take it, in my opinion, beyond coincidence. Just a touch of authorial license added.

    Leave a comment:

Working...
X