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Sympathy For The Devil

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  • Sympathy For The Devil

    Its virtually impossible to have any sympathy ( even for one of those "candleholder" types that stand outside prisons protesting the execution of a convicted murderer ) whatsover for a person like Ted Bundy. How could one have sympathy for a person like him...a guy who had several positives in his favor ? One woman actually married him in court while he was on trial for murder one. But she's one of the rare exceptions...

    Same thing for the greaseball, John Wayne Gacy, but for different reasons. Pig-like, belligerent, and devoid of any sympathy towards the young guys he disposed of like so much garbage, he merits few tears. Speck,Dahmer,Baumeister, Kurten and Fred West... are all less than sympathetic characters as well.

    All these individuals lived in what were more than likely softer and easier times than Jack The Ripper. None were affected by known diseases,such as syphilis or insanity. Just an overpowering urge to manifest their will and whims on people in the direction of Evil.

    Does Jack The Ripper fit in with them in that respect...or perhaps,does he or has he ever elicited any sympathy from you,considering the fact we don't know if he had some condition which made him the way he was?

    Don't misunderstand me here...he merits the noose...and being a womankiller, I'd pay to do the job..... But would it be a little less easy,shall we say, to place him in front of Messrs. Berry & Billington on the scaffold than the others aforementioned ?

    Let us know.

    Thanks
    8
    No. He was no different than any murderer.
    50.00%
    4
    No. Despite the possibility he was not completely in control of himself, hang him anyway
    12.50%
    1
    No. Who cares? One less burden on the State. Hang him.
    0.00%
    0
    Yes. Minor, yet enough to separate him from those who could control themselves
    37.50%
    3
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  • #2
    Hi How
    Good post!
    I watched an episode of Criminal Minds this week and was surprised by the outcome. A graphic artist who's finance was killed by a gang had a psychotic episode and killed all the gang members in an ultra violent fashion, yet was totally unaware on any rational level that he had carried out these crimes (he had drawn the crime scenes depicting the gang members as monsters - which is how he perceived them on an unconscious level)
    The team had a hard job reconciling him with his crimes, as he elicited sympathy.
    Ali
    xx

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Raven View Post
      Hi How
      Good post!
      I watched an episode of Criminal Minds this week and was surprised by the outcome. A graphic artist who's finance was killed by a gang had a psychotic episode and killed all the gang members in an ultra violent fashion, yet was totally unaware on any rational level that he had carried out these crimes (he had drawn the crime scenes depicting the gang members as monsters - which is how he perceived them on an unconscious level)
      The team had a hard job reconciling him with his crimes, as he elicited sympathy.
      Ali
      xx

      Would that be fiancé, Ali?
      Christopher T. George, Lyricist & Co-Author, "Jack the Musical"
      https://www.facebook.com/JackTheMusical/ Hear sample song at https://tinyurl.com/y8h4envx.

      Organizer, RipperCon #JacktheRipper-#True Crime Conferences, April 2016 and 2018.
      Hear RipperCon 2016 & 2018 talks at http://www.casebook.org/podcast/.

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      • #4
        Hi Chris - that would be spell-checker
        Actually, with some of the WAG's in the press it could well be the same thing

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        • #5
          My wife kills my finances daily!!

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          • #6
            If Jack was, say, a paranoid schizophrenic, then I don't see how it's possible to hang him. But I would place him in an asylum - probably for the rest of his life.

            I am not familiar with Bundy etc. These murderers were rather vulgar chaps - they were caught!

            Regards

            Lord Snooty

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            • #7
              I had a feeling that this "subject" might be touchy, so let me try to explain what I meant again. I "rushed" this thread without fully elaborating.

              Of course no one feels sympathy for someone who murders. Thats a given and I wasn't trying to be "cute" by suggesting that any of us might have sympathy for a killer. The scenario that Ali Bevan provided would be one that I would be sympathetic in....but that wouldn't qualify as a serial killing...

              I meant it in the way that Robert Linford's answer is applicable to. Would we have an issue with doling out capital punishment to the Ripper if he suffered from a disease such as schizophrenia as opposed to doling out capital punishment to someone like the individuals mentioned in the first post...all of whom were able to do something about their "condition" ?

              If we did make a distinction between someone like Bundy, who could control himself if the bastard had wanted to...and someone who couldn't, like our hypothetical Ripper here...would we, if faced with the decision as to his fate...hang him or incarcerate him for life? Even if the location you reside in has a mandatory life sentence for someone with paranoid schizophrenia, would you still wish to see the bastard hung?

              Thanks for mentioning what you did, Robert.
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              • #8
                Hi How

                I don't think I would be happy to see a mentally ill person strung up. After all, he may have killed his victim under the impression he was killing the devil, etc.

                Murders committed when under the influence of some mind-altering substance, where the person isn't in control of his faculties at the time,are another area. Basically if someone deliberately takes LSD, gets drunk etc and then goes out and kills someone, then I hold them responsible. But if someone spiked their drink, then I don't see how they are totally to blame.

                I'm not sure that I'm 100% pro capital punishment, if only a life sentence really meant life - and not five or six years. Over here, they dispense justice on a supermarket principle - do one murder, and do another two murders free. They seem to serve no extra time at all.

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                • #9
                  I have to agree with Robert, I would not be happy to see anyone with a diminished capacity strung up. I also agree, in most cases life should mean life in some kind of secure environment (a prison or psychiatric unit). I am definitely not pro capital punishment, if one innocent man / woman is executed the system doesn't work. The deterrent should be prison conditions, but according to popular press in the UK recently
                  http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...-break-in.html
                  conditions in some prisons are so cushy, that people actually try to break in!

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                  • #10
                    Jack's very elusivness indicates that he knew the nature of his actions - hang 'im high.
                    Tel
                    Lacerta es reptiles quisnam mos non exsisto accuso nusquam

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                    • #11
                      We talk with the knowledge of our age, How.
                      Many of the poor bastards who were HMP'd back in the LVP for killing their loved ones, or complete strangers, were being prescribed medical treatment from their doctors which in fact turned them into complete and utter maniacs, more than capable of slaughtering their own, or others; and I don't believe we can hold these people responsible or culpable for their actions, no matter how disgusting we might find the crime today.
                      I have found so many cases now, where prescribed medicines of the time, have led to wholesale slaughter, that I think we are not in a position to morally judge the outcome of such events.
                      If the Whitechapel Murderer had been caught he would not have been hung, but quickly HMP'd to Broadmoor, to avoid a painful trial at the Old Bailey, and then played billiards for the rest of his life.
                      Which is what I think happened anyway.

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                      • #12
                        On Tel's point, which is an argument often used against the idea that Jack was a total nutter (because if he was crazy he'd have been caught standing beside Kate's body, spouting gibberish) :

                        To put it at an extreme, if I was convinced that everyone was really a flesh-eating lizard in disguise, then I'd take care not to get caught, however crazy I was.

                        We know that loonies can be surprisingly cunning, e.g. staff at Broadmoor and other such places used to complain that they weren't safe - the lunatics knew that if they killed a warder, nothing further could happen to them beyond what had already happened to them.

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