"Skewering The Ripperologists" Bad Women Podcast- Hallie Rubenhold

[Howard Brown]

Thanks Chris.....

[Edward Stow]

I would suggest, that fear of denunciation as a consequence of stating unfashionable truths dominates academia. What comes first? A comfortable career and invites to dinner parties... or the truth.
That is a rhetorical question.

[Gary Barnett]

Has anyone read this?

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/earthandskye.org/2019/12/06/the-ballad-of-kate-eddowes-by-david-bishop/amp/

[Howard Brown]

Gary:


You might have hit on something here, buddy.

I have the anthology it appears in and didn't notice the story until now.

David Bishop's fictional story, The Ballad of Kate Eddowes, predates Rube's semi-fictional, "The Five" by a few years. Maxim Jakubowski's anthology came out in 2015.

Do you think this might be the source for Rube's claim that Eddowes was the Carole King of Spitalfields ?

Rube had a recent podcast titled, The Ballad of Kate Eddowes.....not Catherine Eddowes....Kate Eddowes.....

Could Rube have used a completely fictional story written prior to The Five and claimed it to be a fact ?

Me ? I wouldn't be surprised if it's true that she did.

[Howard Brown]

Fer Chrissakes.....I posted a link to that story in the year The Five came out....but did not think to compare it to what Rube wrote.

https://www.jtrforums.com/forum/the-victims/catherine-eddowes/33221-ballad-of-kate-eddowes

[Gary Barnett]

Gary:


You might have hit on something here, buddy.

I have the anthology it appears in and didn't notice the story until now.

David Bishop's fictional story, The Ballad of Kate Eddowes, predates Rube's semi-fictional, "The Five" by a few years. Maxim Jakubowski's anthology came out in 2015.

Do you think this might be the source for Rube's claim that Eddowes was the Carole King of Spitalfields ?

Rube had a recent podcast titled, The Ballad of Kate Eddowes.....not Catherine Eddowes....Kate Eddowes.....

Could Rube have used a completely fictional story written prior to The Five and claimed it to be a fact ?

Me ? I wouldn't be surprised if it's true that she did.

Here’s a review of it from 2019. Sound familiar?



“Kate Eddowes wasn’t just a victim, she was also a person. And one man is determined to make sure that she’s remembered for that.

This is a great flickering story – it jumps between the present and the past surrounding Kate Eddowes murder. And brings to life the woman who lost her life. By showing the before and after of her murder, The Ballad of Kate Eddowes brings to life a woman who is only normally considered as a victim, and not a being in her own right.

This short story is all about making the victims of Jack the Ripper REAL. They’re not just people who were killed, but they lived a life beforehand. They left behind lovers and friends, enemies and people who would miss them. It’s the most realistic and touching of the stories so far in The Mammoth Book of Jack the Ripper Stories collection. Because it diminishes Jack’s acts and highlights what he destroyed…

There is music interspersed throughout this story. After all, it’s a ballad of love and loss. One that will make you stop and actually consider who was lost before you think about who did the taking.”

[Howard Brown]

Gary:

If you or anyone else has the Jakubowski book ( Page 381-391 ) you might want to compare it to the content of the podcast, too.

What you posted sounds very similar, if not identical, to the tone of Rube's romanticizing of Eddowes' imaginary life.

This might be big, buddy.

[Gary Barnett]

Gary:

If you or anyone else has the Jakubowski book ( Page 381-391 ) you might want to compare it to the content of the podcast, too.

What you posted sounds very similar, if not identical, to the tone of Rube's romanticizing of Eddowes' imaginary life.

This might be big, buddy.

I don’t have a copy myself, and the Google books version doesn’t include that particular story. If no one else has it, I may buy one online. HR doesn’t include it in her bibliography, but she does include MJ’s ‘Mammoth Book of JTR’.

[Debra Arif]

I don’t have a copy myself, and the Google books version doesn’t include that particular story. If no one else has it, I may buy one online. HR doesn’t include it in her bibliography, but she does include MJ’s ‘Mammoth Book of JTR’.

https://archive.org/details/mammothb...d&view=theater

"They kept walking, and then Tom started singing. It was the ballad they had written together, the one they were planning to sell. The one about hanging. Eventually, Kate joined in and, as their voices grew louder, they tried to outdo each other, until Kate pushed Tom in the side and he pushed her back, and they fell on to the road in a heap, laughing in the dark."

Note also the language of the fictional detective when referring to Eddowes and the other victims..

[Howard Brown]

CGP, Debs, Gary....look in your email....you too, Senor Banks

[Gary Barnett]

Thanks Debs and How!

[Michael Banks]

A few questions (my memory of any research on Eddowes background is poor so my apologies for asking what might seem obvious questions)

Are any of the quotes in the podcast based on anything known or are they just made up? For example she has Conway saying: “Kate I shall be hung for you one of these days.” Then she has a quote from a family member saying how much John Kelly was hated for his excessive drinking. Then there was a quote from Catherine’s sister Emma saying how “we wish especially to get her away.”

Do we know for a fact that she first went to London from Wolverhampton by canal?

Do we know for a fact that she was at Robinson’s hanging or is this an assumption based on the fact that she was related to him?

She says that John Kelly was a heavy drinker. Is this true? According to Sugden, Frederick Wilkinson had never seen him drunk but that Kate did like a drink or three.

I have to say though that probably the most irritating thing for me is the tone. It always sounds to me like she’s making revelations that she’s just uncovered about the terrible conditions and hardships that women at that time had to deal with, as well as the derogatory attitudes that were held toward them. As if Ripperology has been keeping these uncomfortable facts to itself for years before St Halle arrived on the scene bringing truth and justice as her mission. I eagerly await her next book The Framing Of Amelia Dyer.

[Michael Banks]

CGP, Debs, Gary....look in your email....you too, Senor Banks

Cheers How, at first glance I thought “what’s this got to do with Carrie Brown?”

[Howard Brown]

Mike:

Someone, a year and a half ago, said they'd prefer Rube write a book about Carrie Brown rather than Crippen on a social media page.
At first glance, I rolled my eyes because if Nina hasn't found anything more than what she's already uncovered, then all of what we'll ever know, we know now. That you can take to the bank, Mr. Banks.

[Linotte]

Gary:


You might have hit on something here, buddy.

I have the anthology it appears in and didn't notice the story until now.

David Bishop's fictional story, The Ballad of Kate Eddowes, predates Rube's semi-fictional, "The Five" by a few years. Maxim Jakubowski's anthology came out in 2015.

Do you think this might be the source for Rube's claim that Eddowes was the Carole King of Spitalfields ?

Rube had a recent podcast titled, The Ballad of Kate Eddowes.....not Catherine Eddowes....Kate Eddowes.....

Could Rube have used a completely fictional story written prior to The Five and claimed it to be a fact ?

Me ? I wouldn't be surprised if it's true that she did.

According to what R has previously stated, she sent the book proposal to her publisher on 2015. She also began research at about that time, too.

Check the Eddowes portion of the book against the story, just to see if anything was lifted from that without acknowledgment or citation. Make sure your case is water-tight before reaching out to the publisher or the producer, though.

I’m pursuing the academic angle, but I’m really interested to see how this turns out.