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  • Pinchin Street

    The Penny Illustrated Paper and Illustrated Times (London, England), Saturday, September 21, 1889



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  • #2
    Thanks for posting this up, How, very useful... I for one didn't know the police dredged parts of the Thames after the discovery of the Pinchin Torso, that sort of shows you what they were thinking, and it certainly wasn't Jack the Ripper.
    As you can imagine I've got a lot of issues I want to discuss in relation to the Pinchin Torso, the least of which is the estimated time of death given by the police surgeons of the time, varying from 24 to 48 hours, which doesn't quite fit in with the vivid descriptions of the torso when it was first discovered, the attention of the police constable involved being firstly aroused by the putrid smell of the torso. Such putrification is highly unlikely to be detectable in a human corpse in the very short time period given by the police surgeons, and is more indictive of a corpse that has been so for at least a week, when not longer.
    The fact that the missing parts of the Pinchin victim were never found, when in every other Torso case they were, leads me to speculate that the victim had been murdered a long time before her torso was dumped in Pinchin Street; and was perhaps dumped there by a third party with no connection to the murder whatsoever.

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    • #3
      Hi Ap,
      The date of the find was September 11th I think.Early September may not be as hot as August but this year average temperatures were between 75 and 80 C---hot enough to cause a stench ,I would have thought if a dead body was left around for more than a few days.
      Best

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      • #4
        You're very welcome A.P. Glad it is of use.

        Same to you,Nats....thank you for the reminder about the heat in September of '88.
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        • #5
          Originally posted by A.P. Wolf View Post
          Thanks for posting this up, How, very useful... I for one didn't know the police dredged parts of the Thames after the discovery of the Pinchin Torso, that sort of shows you what they were thinking, and it certainly wasn't Jack the Ripper.
          Like a dog used to chasing after a bone, it makes sense that after the experience of other bodies found all round the London area, the police would seek to see if they could find any other body parts.

          Originally posted by A.P. Wolf View Post
          As you can imagine I've got a lot of issues I want to discuss in relation to the Pinchin Torso, the least of which is the estimated time of death given by the police surgeons of the time, varying from 24 to 48 hours, which doesn't quite fit in with the vivid descriptions of the torso when it was first discovered, the attention of the police constable involved being firstly aroused by the putrid smell of the torso. Such putrification is highly unlikely to be detectable in a human corpse in the very short time period given by the police surgeons, and is more indictive of a corpse that has been so for at least a week, when not longer.
          Good thinking, AP.

          Originally posted by A.P. Wolf View Post
          The fact that the missing parts of the Pinchin victim were never found, when in every other Torso case they were, leads me to speculate that the victim had been murdered a long time before her torso was dumped in Pinchin Street; and was perhaps dumped there by a third party with no connection to the murder whatsoever.
          I am not quite sure that I follow your reasoning that the Pinchin Street torso "was perhaps dumped there by a third party with no connection to the murder whatsoever." If I might ask, what leads you to suggest that?

          All the best

          Chris
          Christopher T. George, Lyricist & Co-Author, "Jack the Musical"
          https://www.facebook.com/JackTheMusical/ Hear sample song at https://tinyurl.com/y8h4envx.

          Organizer, RipperCon #JacktheRipper-#True Crime Conferences, April 2016 and 2018.
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          • #6
            Well, Chris, thanks for your interest; and I'll go back to the issue of the time of death, in that it seems that the police surgeons were wildly out of whack with their estimate of 24 to 48 hours since life was extinct... and this despite Natalie's assertion that the temperatures of September 1888 were above average high. I'll dispute this, simply going on the failed Hop harvest of that year, which failed because of lower than average temperatures, causing rot to set into the valuable crop, and the early return of the hop pickers back to the metropolis - see Catherine Eddowes for more detail on that.
            Regardless of a higher or lower temperature for that time of year, it is highly unlikely that the type of decomposition and odour reported by the police would have been available for at least ten days after death, when not a matter of weeks considering the degraded nature of the torso when found.
            One also has to note, that unlike the Whitehall Torso, in the Pinchin Torso there was no noticeable influence of insect activity, in other words no 'blow fly' maggots, with which the Whitehall Torso was infested with, showing that the Pinchin Torso had been held in an safely enclosed indoor situation where blow fly were not able to access the torso.
            To escape the attentions of blow fly this would need to be a dark and fairly damp and cold environment, especially at that time of year.
            This suggests to me that the torso had been hidden away for some considerable time; and this appears to be confirmed by the lack of body parts that failed to turn up in the usual locations when such a crime had been commited in the past.
            The simple fact that the torso was unable to be matched up to its missing body parts is a strong indication that it was dumped in Pinchin by a third party uninvolved in the actual murder, but rather someone who just wanted to dump it, and avoid the messy and time consuming protocol of reporting it to the police.

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