Carrie Brown/Ameer Ben Ali Discussion Thread Including The Trial & Aftermath

[Michael Banks]

Mike:

Had the police been the people he divulged his decade long deception to....that might work.

However, it wasn't. It was up to the District Attorney's office as the NYPD's role in the case was concluded back in 1891.

The D. A. in 1901 was this man, Eugene Philbin...who only served from 1900 to the end of 1901 :



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugene_A._Philbin

Well I completely missed that obvious point. Time for bed I think. That Druitt thread is a headache. I need to give it a wide berth I think. Old Monty has a strange effect on some people How.

[Howard Brown]

Mike:

I see you've been burnin' the candle at both ends there, amigo. It'd be time for a breather for me, that's for sure.
Until later

[Howard Brown]

Trying my best to find a copy of a photograph of the East River Hotel during the Gilded Age....but it's proven a tough job.

These good good photos were taken by Eugene Armbruster, born in Baden Baden, Germany ( 1865-1943) in 1924.

[Howard Brown]

Outstanding and contemporaneous photo of the Glenmore Hotel....taken circa 1900 by George P. Hill ( 1832-1900 ).






Hill or an associate took the photo on top of the train trestle in Chatham Square. The Glenmore was situated at 4 Chatham Square.




Photo of Chatham Square...the source of the above:




Postcard from 1890...somewhere down to the left in front of the two sailboats would have been Water Street, Catherine Slip, Cherry Street, etc...

[Michael Banks]

Great photos How. All we needed was one true crime buff photographer at the time! Before I knew the first thing about the case I just assumed that someone would have taken a photo.

[Howard Brown]

Mike:

I had hoped that would be the case, buddy.....but there don't seem to be many contemporaneous photos of the Cherry Hill section....
Joel Goldberg said the hotel site was razed in 1938, but there was some sort of edifice on the old 14-16 Catherine Slip site up until the 1940's.
( 1941, if I recall correctly) I posted a photo of that on this or another thread in the section a while back..
Which means that someone erected a one story building where the old five story joint was after the hotel was demolished....but not totally razed,

[Howard Brown]

The list of tenants and corresponding rooms on the fifth floor has been updated



New York Tribune
April 25, 1891
****************

[Howard Brown]

I just came across an article from April 1891 ( A NYC paper) that claims 'J.Buckley' was the name written in for Room 33 where Ali spent that night....although the Tribune article above states clearly that two men, J. Buckley and Murphy, were in Room 30.

I had the article but misplaced it. I'll post the article a.s.a.p.

[Michael Banks]

I just came across an article from April 1891 ( A NYC paper) that claims 'J.Buckley' was the name written in for Room 31 where Ali spent that night....although the Tribune article above states clearly that two men, J. Buckley and Murphy, were in Room 30.

I had the article but misplaced it. I'll post the article a.s.a.p.

Is there any record of the police interviewing the other guests How? At the very least they would have asked if anyone saw or heard anything.

[Howard Brown]

The only fifth floor tenant who appears in print was William C, Mannix.
I'm sure everyone else available for questions was or were queried. Only Mannix seemed to have a story.

[Michael Banks]

I wonder if there was anyone in rooms 34 and 35 that night How? With the EHR’s record for efficiency in registering guests I’d say that it must have been a possibility? If it wasn’t for the blood on Ali then we might have had a third possibility. That unknown Mr X in room 34 killed Brown after Kniclo and Ali had left then he mistakenly went into the wrong room; Ali’s, leaving the blood evidence) That damned blood spoils the idea though How.

[Howard Brown]

Mike;

One issue...again with the press reportage...is that in some accounts different names appear ( one had two names Buckley and Warder....the name of the dude who married my great Grandmom after my great grandpop died of typhoid in 1894) was George Buckley Warder ( Philadelphia Cricket guy...supposed to be pretty good)....which makes it difficult to ascertain exactly as to who was where and when..

On no chart that I've seen do the Mannixes appear. Yet, Mannix, the only one to speak to the press, had to be there. In addition, if the Evening World report ( April 24th) was correct, Mannix and his wife should have been listed on the register as they had
been there on Tuesday and maybe since Tuesday...the day Ali tried to break in their room to get at Mannix's wife.
I've read well over a thousand articles from the newspapers on this 'section' of the Brown murder....the first two days after the murder...and as I said, have never seen the Mannixes listed on a press-created chart.

[Michael Banks]

Could Mannix have been a false name How?

[Howard Brown]

Mike:

If you recall, I posted an article which you commented on about William C. Mannix and his wife in 1897 or 1896 when she stabbed him....the name is probably a true one....although Thompson admitted to fabricating names for the register at the Coroner Inquest.

[Michael Banks]

Yes, I’d forgotten about that How.

I’ve been trying to think if there could have been another scenario as to what might have happened that night just to see if any other possibility exists no matter how unlikely but there’s just nothing unless we go into accomplice territory. It had to be either Ali or Kniclo/Glenmore/Farmhand.