Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Carrie Brown/Ameer Ben Ali Discussion Thread Including The Trial & Aftermath

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by Kattrup View Post
    Yes, thanks - I’ve read that, she gives a bit more info at the trial where she mentions her home town of Henry.

    Though she leaves out her family’s name, I think Henry is sufficiently small that she may yet be identified. She mentions siblings, I think, at least one sister. Her parents were alive until 1888 or later, I think she last heard from them three years before the trial. Will have to check.
    She mentions having “sisters”, and that when she last heard from a sister a year before the trial, her parents were alive and well. I think she ought to be identifiable if there are censuses or birth registrations for Henry from the latter half of the 19th century.
    She also mentions that her husband resided with his mother when he died in 1881.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Kattrup View Post

      She mentions having “sisters”, and that when she last heard from a sister a year before the trial, her parents were alive and well. I think she ought to be identifiable if there are censuses or birth registrations for Henry from the latter half of the 19th century.
      She also mentions that her husband resided with his mother when he died in 1881.
      Hmm, I just noticed that in 1881, her parents and sisters were living in White Plains, NY. But in 1887 they were in Henry, IL.

      So maybe I was too quick to suppose Henry her home town.

      Comment


      • Kattrup:

        I found that thread concerning Ali and his military service. It's in the PDF
        Attached Files
        To Join JTR Forums :
        Contact [email protected]

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Howard Brown View Post
          Kasttrup:

          I found that thread concerning Ali and his military service. It's in the PDF
          Thank you very much. So according to the papers, the French Consulate confirmed his service with the Turcos. Enlisted 1870, so in 1891 he would have been older than the 35 his cousin stated. Probably closer to 45.

          Comment


          • 45 sounds like a reasonable age. Born circa 1846, he'd be at least 23 going on 24 when he joined. My original estimate put him joining at 20-21 years old and being born in 1850 and approx. 41 in 1891.
            To Join JTR Forums :
            Contact [email protected]

            Comment


            • On a side note....in a case in which we see witnesses ( the prostitutes ) being somewhat humiliated by having to give perfect strangers an accounting of their descent into a cycle of drinking and whoring and it really being a case of being in the wrong profession and place at the wrong time & spending eight weeks in The Tombs ( it would have been more if Judge Smyth gave defense attorney Friend his wish and kept them there for two more months until House recuperated) ...there is really only one 'glamorized' visual description of any of the women involved, that being this sketch of Carrie Brown in the New York Evening World ( April 25, 1891 ) which does not truly reflect what she looked like at the time of her death.

              To Join JTR Forums :
              Contact [email protected]

              Comment


              • What relation to the Brown Murder Case...how does the man on the right fit in ?

                For an extra pat on the back, who's the dude on the left ?





                To Join JTR Forums :
                Contact [email protected]

                Comment


                • Nina did some searching for a photo of the East River Hotel today. She found this photo of a building on the SW corner of Peck Slip and South Street...an 8 minute walk from Catherine Slip and Water street.

                  The color of the brickwork matches the description of the hotel back in 1891 ( yellow brick, according to one newspaper). Like the ERH, it is a five-story building with a similar awning jutting out in front on both streets.

                  This is that photo taken in 1981




                  This is a photo of it today in 2022



                  This is the Hotel in 1891.





                  This is the building on Peck Slip and South Street from 1981 with modifications

                  To Join JTR Forums :
                  Contact [email protected]

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Howard Brown View Post
                    What relation to the Brown Murder Case...how does the man on the right fit in ?

                    For an extra pat on the back, who's the dude on the left ?
                    Not Babe Ruth, is it?

                    Comment


                    • Yes, it's Babe Ruth.
                      To Join JTR Forums :
                      Contact [email protected]

                      Comment


                      • That’s a good find from Nina. It could be the closest we can get of an idea of what the EHR might have looked like.
                        Regards

                        Michael🔎


                        " When you eliminate the impossible whatever remains no matter how improbable......is probably a little bit boring "

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Howard Brown View Post
                          What relation to the Brown Murder Case...how does the man on the right fit in ?

                          For an extra pat on the back, who's the dude on the left ?




                          I really haven’t a clue How but I’ve tried to decipher those signatures with little luck. But I’ll have a guess…is it Schultze?
                          Regards

                          Michael🔎


                          " When you eliminate the impossible whatever remains no matter how improbable......is probably a little bit boring "

                          Comment


                          • Mike:

                            It sure is....took both of us for a surprise considering its appearance ( similar brickwork, awning, and height). Not sure if the same builder erected the Peck Slip and Catherine Slip buildings.

                            Don't say I never gave you nuttin', dude.....here's 10 aliases used by Ali, names given to him, or fanciful misspellings of names he used. 10 aliases in 22 months. Criminals usually do have multiple aliases.

                            George Frank
                            Frank Sherlick
                            Frenchy 1
                            French Pete
                            Francis Analgerion
                            Frenchy
                            George Francis
                            George Francois
                            Frank Sherlie
                            Frank Cherlic




                            By the way, the guy to The Babe's right is Jacob Ruppert, Jr. Ruppert was the son of a beer magnate and probably the most important sports-team owner of the first half of the 20th century. His name is on the document, third one on the left hand side of the page. Ruppert bought the team that would become the Yankees from the first Police Chief and last Supt. of Police in New York, Big Bill Devery in 1915.

                            Ruppert served on the Coroner Inquest Jury in May of 1891
                            To Join JTR Forums :
                            Contact [email protected]

                            Comment


                            • Here's a new 'A Face In The Crowd' which features Max Fischel, long time police reporter ( 1863-1939 )...PDF attached

                              Late add-on....Mike, the man with The Babe served on the Coroner Inquest Jury in May 1891....

                              Attached Files
                              To Join JTR Forums :
                              Contact [email protected]

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Howard Brown View Post
                                Mike:

                                It sure is....took both of us for a surprise considering its appearance ( similar brickwork, awning, and height). Not sure if the same builder erected the Peck Slip and Catherine Slip buildings.

                                Don't say I never gave you nuttin', dude.....here's 10 aliases used by Ali, names given to him, or fanciful misspellings of names he used. 10 aliases in 22 months. Criminals usually do have multiple aliases.

                                George Frank
                                Frank Sherlick
                                Frenchy 1
                                French Pete
                                Francis Analgerion
                                Frenchy
                                George Francis
                                George Francois
                                Frank Sherlie
                                Frank Cherlic




                                By the way, the guy to The Babe's right is Jacob Ruppert, Jr. Ruppert was the son of a beer magnate and probably the most important sports-team owner of the first half of the 20th century. His name is on the document, third one on the left hand side of the page. Ruppert bought the team that would become the Yankees from the first Police Chief and last Supt. of Police in New York, Big Bill Devery in 1915.

                                Ruppert served on the Coroner Inquest Jury in May of 1891
                                I saw the words Coroners Office and took a stab. I’ll go to the back of the class.

                                You could be right about it being the same builder How. It certainly gives you feel for what it might have looked like. The one in Nina’s photo is boarded up but I’d still rather stay there for a night than at the ERH.

                                …..

                                Looking at those aliases there are certainly 4 that I either hadn’t seen before or that I’d seen but hadn’t registered for whatever reason. French Pete, Francis Analgerion (sounds like some kind of haemorrhoid cream) and the last two.

                                A fine, upstanding citizen our Mr Ali.

                                Regards

                                Michael🔎


                                " When you eliminate the impossible whatever remains no matter how improbable......is probably a little bit boring "

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X