Mrs Rees 1888

[Paul Williams]

I may have tracked down the marriage certificate of Denis Kelly and Julia Foley in Swansea in January 1858. Julia was previously married to a man called Roach. Her father's name was given as Michael Foley (deceased), a labourer.

Denis was described as a labourer and widowed. His father was also Denis and a labourer. This creates a slight doubt over the identification because Dennis, the father of Abigail Kelly, was described as a rag-gather in October 1858 before becoming a marine store dealer in the early 1860s. Otherwise the details, including the ages, fit. Both were in their early thirties, raising the possibility of children from their previous marriages.

In 1896 when Julia was destitute the Llanelly Board of Guardians suggested that her two daughters in Swansea might be able to help. I assumed this meant that her daughers by Denis, Margaret and Julia, were both in Swansea. We know that Abigail was in America. However it could refer to a daughter by Roach.

The next step is to trace Denis's first marriage. If he already had a daughter then possibly there is another candidate for John Rees's identification.

[Paul Williams]

I have written an article on The Carmarthen Mystery for a new true-crime anthology, The Best New True Crime Stories: Small Towns edited by Mitzi Sereto which is due for publication in July.

Recently, as mentioned in Rippercast, I identifed Mary Rees as the ex convict who spoke to the press about Florence Maybrick in 1895.

I am still trying to find a definite link between the Hopkins, Rees ,and Kelly families prior to 1885.

[Paul Williams]

In March 1863 Hopkins ended his tenancy and gave possession of the Picton Terrace House to Davies, also selling her some furniture. The deal was that she paid the rent and he used the premises for one day a week, paying 15 shillings.
Later the bailiffs tried to claim the furniture, believing it belonged to Hopkins.

We know of one child in the 1840s who he had to pay for. Interestingly the mother, like Caroline Davies, said they were once patients of his.

I am putting together a more detailed piece on Hopkins, expanding on the Ripperologist article and hope to have this completed in the next few weeks.

[R. J. Palmer]

Yes, it's on the posh side, and yet Dr. Hopkins is said to have only stayed there one day per week. His supposed full-time 'housekeeper' is listed as an 'annuitant' in the census. The whole set up is rather odd. I also couldn't help but notice that Dr. Hopkins once again has an unmarried female visitor in the house at the time of the census, one Mary Richards of Dowlais. Somewhat foreshadows 1881. What is the connection between Davis from London and Richards from Dowlais?

[Sam Flynn]

Between 1858 and 1863 John Morgan Hopkins had a house at Picton Terrace, Carmarthen

Picton Terrace was built in the 1820s, and is still there. Quite attractive, too - I note from various websites that a number of the houses are Grade II listed buildings.

[R. J. Palmer]

I wonder if there is any relevance to the fact that the birthplace of Caroline C. Davis/Davies is listed as 'St. George, London' (Ancestry tries to suggest she was christened in Bethnal Green, but this would need confirmation) and the odd fact that years later Barbara L's surfaces in the East End. Assuming this is the same person.

[R. J. Palmer]

Between 1858 and 1863 John Morgan Hopkins had a house at Picton Terrace, Carmarthen, with a housekeeper called Caroline Davies. The 1861 census shows Caroline at the address with a three year daughter, Barbara L said to have been born in Swansea.

Possibly she is the Barbara Louisa Hopkins who turns up twenty years later as Morgan Hopkin's daughter.

Brilliant. Well played, Mr. Williams.

If this is her, which seems more than probable, I wonder if she ever reverted back to 'Barbara Davies.'

Clever work!

[Paul Williams]

Between 1858 and 1863 John Morgan Hopkins had a house at Picton Terrace, Carmarthen, with a housekeeper called Caroline Davies. The 1861 census shows Caroline at the address with a three year daughter, Barbara L said to have been born in Swansea.

Possibly she is the Barbara Louisa Hopkins who turns up twenty years later as Morgan Hopkin's daughter.

[R. J. Palmer]

The Barbara Louisa Hopkins that became Barbara Louisa Trick is clearly not our gal, but it is mildly interesting that her sister Mary J[ones] Hopkins, who got married and became Mary Trollope, is listed as a 'midwife' in the 1911 census.

But none of it adds up. She and her sister, Mrs. Trick, seem to have lived entirely normal, stable lives.

The strange thing about this saga is that all the bit players can be readily traced with little or no difficulty, but when it comes to Barbara Louisa and Mary J, they remain, like Mary Kelly herself, entirely elusive.

[Paul Williams]

Emily Cope was sent to John Morgan Hopkins by Andrew Francis Bayntun who was described in the press as a married dentist.

He married Elizabeth Crocker in Swansea 1859 but she filed for divorce in 1878 after he moved to Bath without her consent. This doesn't appear to have been finalised because in the 1881 census she was still calling herself a Dentist's wife. Her husband was then living with Emily Morris, a Welshgirl posing as his wife who died in 1883 and was buried as Bayntun. They had a child Constance who was adopted by relatives.

Bayntun died in France in 1890. His probate record says he was formerly of 1 Quay Street, Cardigan.

[R. J. Palmer]

I am fairly certain that Barbara's second finance in 1887 is the same man mentioned earlier; the William Henry Deas born in Whitechapel in 1860. He is in the 1861 census, living at No. 29 Lower East Smithfield with his parents John and Ann. His father was a custom's 'tidewaiter,' born Scotland. What is somewhat interesting is that WHD seems to have ended up in Cardiff in his middle-age, married to yet another Mary Jane. (1911 census) It's an interesting mystery, but I think I may have to give it up.

[Robert Linford]

I don't know how this might fit in. Hemy? Henry?

[R. J. Palmer]

I stayed up late last night looking this over. I see now that I turned 'marriage banns' turned into marriage bands...another hour of midnight oil and they would have become orchestras.

A possible clue to finding out more about the identities of Mary Jane and Barbara Louisa Hopkins might be found in the Emily Cope abortion case from 1884. Mary Jane Hopkins mentions a 'relative' named Emily Morgan, the daughter of Thomas Morgan of Llangennech, who was said to have been on good terms with Dr. Thomas Morgan Hopkins. Emily even gives a deposition at the inquest and is described as a 'young girl.' Unfortunately, Morgan appears to have been a common name down in that part of Wales and it might take considerable work to sort it out. There is an easy-to-find Thomas Morgan, born Llangennech in 1847, but he doesn't appear to be the right person.

[Paul Williams]

Yes, Dear and Deas were separate individuals. That leaves us with Barbara possibly engaged to two different widowers in 1887.

[Cogidubnus]

You can see on his children's marriage bands and elsewhere that his name was actually William Henry Dear. In the 1891 Census he is living at No. 27 Cook's Road, Kennington Park (Newington St Mary, District 5) which is the same address listed on the christening of Francis Sydney Deas in 1893. Assuming we have the same guy...which I am no long sure of..

The William Henry Deas born in Whitechapel in 1860 is not the same guy who married Mary Elizabeth Eunice...and ended up in Cook's Road, Kennington Park.

I **think** Barbara L. got engaged to Deas from Whitechapel/Poplar, and Dear from Newington/Kennington is someone else entirely, having been born in Uxbridge in 1858. Ancestry transcription errors wrongly recorded him as Deas.

Hi Roger

Reverting to the banns, check out the "s" on the end of Deas, compared to that in Louise..they're pretty much identical...I'm not entirely sure "Deas" and the "Dear" produced are one and the same person...

Dave