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Could These Be Alice Mackenzie's Relatives ?

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  • Some of Alice's entries in to the workhouse mention that she had been brought in by a PC (various different ones from different divisions) for being drunk. I mentioned this before; it looks like the police sometimes used the workhouse rather than police station cells for drunks picked up at night. In Alice's 1877 Mint St entry for example, she was brought to the workhouse by PC 110 L 'charged with being drunk' and was admitted late in the day as it was recorded that her next meal was going to be breakfast. Alice was discharged in to the charge of PC 256 L the morning after.

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    • I bet there was a lot of paperwork back and forth between the police and the workhouse regarding who paid.

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      • Hi all,

        Marvellous work!

        A thought occurred to me. If McKenzie was really Kinsey or Kensey, and some are looking in the 1861 census for other Kinseys etc.. could it be that Kinsey is again mistakenly written as McKenzie?
        i.e. the other way around...if one is looking for the gentleman?
        you see..if Alice's name can get changed..so can other people's names too...no?

        just a thought.


        Phil
        from 1905...to 19.05..it was written in the stars

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        • Joseph can be found at 6, Causeway Yard, Leicester on the 1861 census, living with his widowed mother, Sarah and sister Jane. His occupation is shown as 'Ap chair maker'.

          His and Sarah's surnames are transcribed on FMP as Kinsery, Jane's, on the next sheet, is correctly Kinsey.

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          • Originally posted by Phil Carter View Post
            Hi all,

            Marvellous work!

            A thought occurred to me. If McKenzie was really Kinsey or Kensey, and some are looking in the 1861 census for other Kinseys etc.. could it be that Kinsey is again mistakenly written as McKenzie?
            i.e. the other way around...if one is looking for the gentleman?
            you see..if Alice's name can get changed..so can other people's names too...no?

            just a thought.


            Phil
            I did give this a go, Phil, BTW.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Gary Barnett View Post
              Joseph can be found at 6, Causeway Yard, Lecicester on the 1861 census, living with his widowed mother, Sarah and sister Jane. His occupation is shown as 'Ap chair maker'.

              His and Sarah's surnames are transcribed on FMP as Kinsery, Jane's, on the next sheet, is correctly Kinsey.

              Yes, despite the age difference in this entry that Robert mentioned, this definitely looks like the right man.

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              • Originally posted by Debra Arif View Post
                Yes, despite the age difference in this entry that Robert mentioned, this definitely looks like the right man.
                Oops! Missed Rob's find.

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                • Originally posted by Gary Barnett View Post
                  Oops! Missed Rob's find.
                  It was the same time our posts crossed saying we couldn't find him in 61. Robert confused me because I didn't know what he was referring to when he mentioned the age and death of George, the father.

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                  • Originally posted by Debra Arif View Post
                    It was the same time our posts crossed saying we couldn't find him in 61. Robert confused me because I didn't know what he was referring to when he mentioned the age and death of George, the father.
                    Yes, I see that now.

                    Does anyone know if the 'blind boy' George Dixon has ever been identified? I notice there was a Dixon family, including a George, living a couple of doors from the Kinseys in 1851. The George was aged 5 at the time, so certainly wouldn't have been condidered a boy in 1889, but it's a curious coincidence.

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                    • Originally posted by Gary Barnett View Post
                      Yes, I see that now.

                      Does anyone know if the 'blind boy' George Dixon has ever been identified? I notice there was a Dixon family, including a George, living a couple of doors from the Kinseys in 1851. The George was aged 5 at the time, so certainly wouldn't have been condidered a boy in 1889, but it's a curios coincidence.
                      I found a possible George Dixon few years ago when researching for an article on McKenzie. I don`t have it to hand but from memory a good candidate for George Dixon was a boy who stayed temporarily at the Gun Street LH. Possibly, because he knew the lodging house keeper, Betty Ryder. It`s by no means definite, but I`ll try and find the article.

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                      • Originally posted by Gary Barnett View Post
                        Yes, I see that now.

                        Does anyone know if the 'blind boy' George Dixon has ever been identified? I notice there was a Dixon family, including a George, living a couple of doors from the Kinseys in 1851. The George was aged 5 at the time, so certainly wouldn't have been condidered a boy in 1889, but it's a curios coincidence.
                        I found a link to Jon Simon's 2014 Ripperologist article. I haven't read it for a while so don't know what information is included.

                        http://www.ripperologist.biz/pdf/ripperologist138.pdf

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                        • A friend of Alice McKenzie, Dixon is a young blind boy who lodges at Tenpenny’s. When the police take his
                          statement his address is 29 Star Street, Commercial Road.
                          Possibly the younger brother of deputy keeper Elizabeth Ryder, whose maiden name is Dixon and has a 10-year
                          -old brother called George Dixon.


                          This is what Jon wrote in the article as a possible ID for George.

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                          • Originally posted by Debra Arif View Post
                            A friend of Alice McKenzie, Dixon is a young blind boy who lodges at Tenpenny’s. When the police take his
                            statement his address is 29 Star Street, Commercial Road.
                            Possibly the younger brother of deputy keeper Elizabeth Ryder, whose maiden name is Dixon and has a 10-year
                            -old brother called George Dixon.


                            This is what Jon wrote in the article as a possible ID for George.
                            Thanks Debs :-)
                            I don`t know if the above stands up to scrutiny !!

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Gary Barnett View Post
                              I did give this a go, Phil, BTW.
                              Hello Gary,

                              Yes..thought you might have.. just a thought that popped in.

                              All the best


                              Phil
                              from 1905...to 19.05..it was written in the stars

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Phil Carter View Post
                                Hello Gary,

                                Yes..thought you might have.. just a thought that popped in.

                                All the best


                                Phil
                                For the record, I tried it after you suggested it.

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