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The Richardson's of 29 Hanbury Street

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  • #46
    Originally posted by Edward Stow View Post
    A little bit probably Gary
    That sounds promising.

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    • #47
      Originally posted by R. J. Palmer View Post

      Thanks for that, Debs. It doesn't look very promising, does it?




      To answer my own question: no. John Chaffey never ran 'The Phoenix.'

      He is dead long before 1873.

      I have no idea why Richardson is listing his address as a pub on his 1873 marriage banns. His wife-to-be, Caroline Chaffey is living in Battersea in 1871, so, considering that they met and married within the next two years, I'm going to operate on the assumption that Richardson was still somewhere in Lambeth in 1871 and just hasn't been located--maybe due to a transcription error.
      I suppose he could still be the militia man of the 4th Middlesex and/or still be missing from the census ?

      In 1871 No. 180 Brick Lane was home to about 20 people in separate family units, besides being a beer house (Satchel wasn't there at this time period) but interestingly, on the 1871 census, one of John Richardson's sisters, was listed at the family home on Church Street with the occupation of barmaid.

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      • #48
        Originally posted by Debra Arif View Post

        I suppose he could still be the militia man of the 4th Middlesex and/or still be missing from the census ?

        In 1871 No. 180 Brick Lane was home to about 20 people in separate family units, besides being a beer house (Satchel wasn't there at this time period) but interestingly, on the 1871 census, one of John Richardson's sisters, was listed at the family home on Church Street with the occupation of barmaid.
        Well done! I was hoping to eventually track down the address in 1871. I wonder what Amelia would have thought of her daughter working as a barmaid?

        The only possible explanation I've found for John's whereabouts in 1871 is that there is a lodger in Brixton named 'John' (no last name given) born in Lambeth in 1852, but that hardly proves anything. I think he was a carman of some sort.

        Many years later, John and Caroline Richardson apparently lost an infant son, William, who was born in the workhouse in March 1895. Caroline Richardson's address is given as No. 9 Gun Street, (Spitalfields), wife of John Richardson, "market porter." William is not with them in 1901, so I suspect he died.

        According to an uncertain reference on Casebook, No. 1-9 Gun Street was an annex of the "Providence Row Night Refuge" for "working girls" where Mary Kelly once supposedly stayed at one time, but I wonder if this is accurate, or when it was annexed. There is an account from 1890 that suggests men lived there, which I will post on another thread, as I think it adds another name to Howard's master list of men who were called "Jack the Ripper."

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        • #49
          I can't track down Howard's master list at the moment (I saw it yesterday) but here is an article from Lloyd's that mentions No. 9 Gun Street, Spitalfields.

          Click image for larger version  Name:	George Cooper A.jpg Views:	0 Size:	39.3 KB ID:	587522
          Click image for larger version  Name:	George Cooper B.jpg Views:	0 Size:	60.3 KB ID:	587523

          Obviously, a Jewish bloke living at No. 9 Gun Street in 1890 would put doubt on it being a hostel for "working girls," I would think, as reported here:

          Providence Row Night Refuge - Jack the Ripper Wiki (casebook.org)


          P.S. There was a George Cooper arrested for cutting a woman's throat on the Isle of Sheppey in 1889, but it can't be the same fellow as he was ten years older and was sent to Broadmoor.

          All of this is intensely off-topic, except that No. 9 Gun Street is where Caroline Richardson was listed as living in 1895 in the workhouse infirmary records.

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          • #50
            Originally posted by R. J. Palmer View Post

            Well done! I was hoping to eventually track down the address in 1871. I wonder what Amelia would have thought of her daughter working as a barmaid?

            The only possible explanation I've found for John's whereabouts in 1871 is that there is a lodger in Brixton named 'John' (no last name given) born in Lambeth in 1852, but that hardly proves anything. I think he was a carman of some sort.

            Many years later, John and Caroline Richardson apparently lost an infant son, William, who was born in the workhouse in March 1895. Caroline Richardson's address is given as No. 9 Gun Street, (Spitalfields), wife of John Richardson, "market porter." William is not with them in 1901, so I suspect he died.

            According to an uncertain reference on Casebook, No. 1-9 Gun Street was an annex of the "Providence Row Night Refuge" for "working girls" where Mary Kelly once supposedly stayed at one time, but I wonder if this is accurate, or when it was annexed. There is an account from 1890 that suggests men lived there, which I will post on another thread, as I think it adds another name to Howard's master list of men who were called "Jack the Ripper."
            Well spotted with the 1871 entry. It could be that's him, but it could even be that the page of the census of the street he was living on is completely missing or damaged.

            I think you are correct about the accuracy of the mention of Gun St as an annex of the 'Providence Row night refuge'
            In the 1891 census Gun Street is mostly occupied by Jewish families and individual boarders in lodging houses and houses of multiple occupation. No 9 is home to at least six different families. I checked back to 1871 and it's a similar community with a couple of lodging houses and families occupying shared houses.
            Abraham Blok, 34 born Amsterdam should get you to the street in 1871 and Moses Soller b 1834 Austria should get you in for 1891 if you want to check it out.

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