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  • Henry Hoare

    Just a quick query to see if anyone has any more info on this:

    In the Nottingham Evening Post of Saturday 04 November 1933, Henry Hoare, a retired Metropolitan policeman was reported to be celebrating his 70th wedding anniversay. The article mentions that Henry Hoare was closely connected to the Whitechapel murder investigations and knew all the victims personally.

    Henry died three years later and a 1936 Devon newspaper, the Western Times, recounts the same story although worded slightly different to say that Henry knew one of the victims peronally.

    Henry Hoare lived with his family in Bower Rd. Ratcliff for a number of years. This got me interested. Anyone have any more info on him or know if this has come up before? Thanks.

  • #2
    Debs:

    Thanks for starting a thread about Hoare...the name rang a bell so I went looking....
    Rob Clack in 2009 and then Mike Covell in 2010 posted the same Daily Mirror article about Hoare, but no one followed up on it.
    Good that ye did,lady.

    http://www.jtrforums.com/showthread....3%22#post77298
    http://www.jtrforums.com/showthread....vember+1933%22
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    • #3
      Thanks for the links, How.
      I was wondering if Hoare's descendants had ever been contacted in the past?

      Comment


      • #4
        Some info:-
        The Mirror article of November 1933 says the following:-
        1) Henry Hoare was born in Axmouth, Devon
        2) They were celebrating 70 years of marriage - i.e. married 1863
        3) Henry was 90 years of age - i.e. born about 1843

        Death:-
        Name: Henry J Hoare
        Birth Date: abt 1845
        Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1936
        Age at Death: 91
        Registration district: Axminster
        Inferred County: Devon
        Volume: 5b
        Page: 9

        Marriage:-
        Name: Henry John Hoare
        Date of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec 1863
        Registration district: Axminster
        Inferred County: Devon
        Volume Number: 5b
        Page Number: 5 (click to see others on page)
        Others on page (female):-
        Mary Ann Furmidge or Turmidge
        Mary Ann Real
        Mary Jane Fisher Tucker

        Birth:-
        Name: Henry John Hoare
        Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1845
        Registration district: Axminster
        Inferred County: Devon
        Volume: 10
        Page: 14

        Census:-
        1911
        Shepps, Axmouth, Colyford, Devon
        Head: Henry Hoare aged 66 born Axmouth - Police pensioner - Clerk (Parish Council)
        Wife: Mary Ann Hoare aged 64 born Axmouth
        Married 47 years
        5 children born
        4 children still living

        1891
        29 Bower Street, Ratcliff
        Head: Henry Hoare aged 46 born Axmouth Devon - Metropolitan police constable
        Wife: Mary Ann Hoare aged 44 born Axmouth
        Children:
        Walter G aged 12 born Ratcliff
        Percy J aged 7 born Ratcliff

        1881
        29 Bower Street, Ratcliff
        Head: Henry Hoare aged 36 born Devon, Axmouth - Police constable
        Wife: Mary A Hoare aged 35 born Axmouth
        Children:
        Annie aged 14 born Axmouth
        Kate aged 11 born Axmouth
        Walter G aged 2 born Ratcliff

        1871:
        Woonston, Haselbury Brian, Dorset
        Head: Henry J Hoare aged 26 born Axmouth - Police constable
        Wife: Mary A aged 24 born Axmouth
        Children:
        Emily M aged 7 born Axmouth
        Anne aged 4 born Axmouth
        Kate Real aged 2 born Haselbury Brian
        The unusual middle name of the youngest daughter would indicate that of the list of possible spouses in 1863, Henry married Mary Ann Real.

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        • #5
          Yes, that's him, Chris.
          The Ratcliff mention is what piqued my curiosity after looking him up.
          Does anyone know if Bower Street Ratcliff was in the same area or near Pennington St. etc. And does anyone know which division Hoare was originally in? Shadwell?

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          • #6
            Hi Debs
            There is a map showing the location here


            http://www.londontown.com/LondonStre...reet_332.html/

            Comment


            • #7
              Thanks, Chris. Not too close then?

              I've now contacted three people from different branches of Henry's family.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Debra Arif View Post
                Thanks, Chris. Not too close then?

                I've now contacted three people from different branches of Henry's family.
                Very well done - will be interesting to see if there is any feedback:-)

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Debra Arif View Post
                  Just a quick query to see if anyone has any more info on this:

                  In the Nottingham Evening Post of Saturday 04 November 1933, Henry Hoare, a retired Metropolitan policeman was reported to be celebrating his 70th wedding anniversay. The article mentions that Henry Hoare was closely connected to the Whitechapel murder investigations and knew all the victims personally.
                  Note that the short article in The Daily Mirror, 6 November 1933, says Hoare knew some of the victims. It doesn't claim that he knew all of them. Specifically it states "he knew some of the victims personally."

                  Chris
                  Christopher T. George, Lyricist & Co-Author, "Jack the Musical"
                  https://www.facebook.com/JackTheMusical/ Hear sample song at https://tinyurl.com/y8h4envx.

                  Organizer, RipperCon #JacktheRipper-#True Crime Conferences, April 2016 and 2018.
                  Hear RipperCon 2016 & 2018 talks at http://www.casebook.org/podcast/.

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                  • #10
                    Presumably the same man--

                    As listed in Simon Wood's "H-Division Personnel" on Casebook.


                    H DIVISION PLAIN CLOTHES DUTY - as from October 24th 1888

                    Sergeant 21 Herwin

                    PC 24HR Beaks

                    PC 91 Patrick

                    PC 137 Long

                    PC 234 Wing

                    PC 436 Hawke

                    PC 73 Mitchell

                    PC 246 Bird

                    PC H296 Winter (Times—Aug 30th 1886)

                    PC 364 Dixon

                    PC 36HR Chapman

                    PC 49HR Layton

                    PC 284 Lamerton

                    PC 362 Davis

                    PC H117 Brown (Times—Sep 16th 1886)

                    PC 33HR Warren

                    PC 41HR Miles

                    PC 393 Hoare [emphasis mine]

                    PC 169 Boon

                    PC 70 Gregory
                    Christopher T. George, Lyricist & Co-Author, "Jack the Musical"
                    https://www.facebook.com/JackTheMusical/ Hear sample song at https://tinyurl.com/y8h4envx.

                    Organizer, RipperCon #JacktheRipper-#True Crime Conferences, April 2016 and 2018.
                    Hear RipperCon 2016 & 2018 talks at http://www.casebook.org/podcast/.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Chris G. View Post
                      Note that the short article in The Daily Mirror, 6 November 1933, says Hoare knew some of the victims. It doesn't claim that he knew all of them. Specifically it states "he knew some of the victims personally."

                      Chris
                      Note that I was initially posting about the the two papers that I cited but did not post the contents of, not the Daily Mirror. One version says "He knew all the murderer's victims personally" That is the Nottingham Evening Post - Saturday 04 November 1933
                      The other paper-Fri 22 May 1936, Western Times, Devon, says he "knew one of the Ripper's victims personally."
                      That is exactly how those two newspapers were worded and why I emphasised those two particular words in my original post. Thank you.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        That's fine, Deb. I am just pointing out the difference in the claims. Indeed it appears that there are three different claims. Take your pick--

                        1) Hoare knew all the victims.

                        2) Hoare knew some of the victims.

                        3) Hoare knew one of the victims.

                        Once again we are left wondering whether it was Hoare who told the story differently or if the newspaper men got the story differently.

                        Chris
                        Christopher T. George, Lyricist & Co-Author, "Jack the Musical"
                        https://www.facebook.com/JackTheMusical/ Hear sample song at https://tinyurl.com/y8h4envx.

                        Organizer, RipperCon #JacktheRipper-#True Crime Conferences, April 2016 and 2018.
                        Hear RipperCon 2016 & 2018 talks at http://www.casebook.org/podcast/.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          It's a common enough problem that those of us who trawl and search the papers encounter all the time. The essence of the story is the same: he knew x amount of victims personally and worked on the murder investigation.The specifics in terms of number may be different but that doesn't lessen the interest of the story and interest in Hoare himself, for me.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Chris Scott View Post
                            Very well done - will be interesting to see if there is any feedback:-)
                            Fingers crossed.

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                            • #15
                              Debs:

                              I just took a gander at the British Library for anything on Hoare.....it looks like a major task, for sure.
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