Henry Hoare

[Debra Arif]

Just a quick query to see if anyone has any more info on this:

In the Nottingham Evening Post of Saturday 04 November 1933, Henry Hoare, a retired Metropolitan policeman was reported to be celebrating his 70th wedding anniversay. The article mentions that Henry Hoare was closely connected to the Whitechapel murder investigations and knew all the victims personally.

Henry died three years later and a 1936 Devon newspaper, the Western Times, recounts the same story although worded slightly different to say that Henry knew one of the victims peronally.

Henry Hoare lived with his family in Bower Rd. Ratcliff for a number of years. This got me interested. Anyone have any more info on him or know if this has come up before? Thanks.

[Howard Brown]

Debs:

Thanks for starting a thread about Hoare...the name rang a bell so I went looking....
Rob Clack in 2009 and then Mike Covell in 2010 posted the same Daily Mirror article about Hoare, but no one followed up on it.
Good that ye did,lady.

http://www.jtrforums.com/showthread....3%22#post77298
http://www.jtrforums.com/showthread....vember+1933%22

[Debra Arif]

Thanks for the links, How.
I was wondering if Hoare's descendants had ever been contacted in the past?

[Chris Scott]

Some info:-
The Mirror article of November 1933 says the following:-
1) Henry Hoare was born in Axmouth, Devon
2) They were celebrating 70 years of marriage - i.e. married 1863
3) Henry was 90 years of age - i.e. born about 1843

Death:-
Name: Henry J Hoare
Birth Date: abt 1845
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1936
Age at Death: 91
Registration district: Axminster
Inferred County: Devon
Volume: 5b
Page: 9

Marriage:-
Name: Henry John Hoare
Date of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec 1863
Registration district: Axminster
Inferred County: Devon
Volume Number: 5b
Page Number: 5 (click to see others on page)
Others on page (female):-
Mary Ann Furmidge or Turmidge
Mary Ann Real
Mary Jane Fisher Tucker

Birth:-
Name: Henry John Hoare
Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1845
Registration district: Axminster
Inferred County: Devon
Volume: 10
Page: 14

Census:-
1911
Shepps, Axmouth, Colyford, Devon
Head: Henry Hoare aged 66 born Axmouth - Police pensioner - Clerk (Parish Council)
Wife: Mary Ann Hoare aged 64 born Axmouth
Married 47 years
5 children born
4 children still living

1891
29 Bower Street, Ratcliff
Head: Henry Hoare aged 46 born Axmouth Devon - Metropolitan police constable
Wife: Mary Ann Hoare aged 44 born Axmouth
Children:
Walter G aged 12 born Ratcliff
Percy J aged 7 born Ratcliff

1881
29 Bower Street, Ratcliff
Head: Henry Hoare aged 36 born Devon, Axmouth - Police constable
Wife: Mary A Hoare aged 35 born Axmouth
Children:
Annie aged 14 born Axmouth
Kate aged 11 born Axmouth
Walter G aged 2 born Ratcliff

1871:
Woonston, Haselbury Brian, Dorset
Head: Henry J Hoare aged 26 born Axmouth - Police constable
Wife: Mary A aged 24 born Axmouth
Children:
Emily M aged 7 born Axmouth
Anne aged 4 born Axmouth
Kate Real aged 2 born Haselbury Brian
The unusual middle name of the youngest daughter would indicate that of the list of possible spouses in 1863, Henry married Mary Ann Real.

[Debra Arif]

Yes, that's him, Chris.
The Ratcliff mention is what piqued my curiosity after looking him up.
Does anyone know if Bower Street Ratcliff was in the same area or near Pennington St. etc. And does anyone know which division Hoare was originally in? Shadwell?

[Chris Scott]

Hi Debs
There is a map showing the location here


http://www.londontown.com/LondonStre...reet_332.html/

[Debra Arif]

Thanks, Chris. Not too close then?

I've now contacted three people from different branches of Henry's family.

[Chris Scott]

Thanks, Chris. Not too close then?

I've now contacted three people from different branches of Henry's family.

Very well done - will be interesting to see if there is any feedback:-)

[Chris G.]

Just a quick query to see if anyone has any more info on this:

In the Nottingham Evening Post of Saturday 04 November 1933, Henry Hoare, a retired Metropolitan policeman was reported to be celebrating his 70th wedding anniversay. The article mentions that Henry Hoare was closely connected to the Whitechapel murder investigations and knew all the victims personally.

Note that the short article in The Daily Mirror, 6 November 1933, says Hoare knew some of the victims. It doesn't claim that he knew all of them. Specifically it states "he knew some of the victims personally."

Chris

[Chris G.]

Presumably the same man--

As listed in Simon Wood's "H-Division Personnel" on Casebook.


H DIVISION PLAIN CLOTHES DUTY - as from October 24th 1888

Sergeant 21 Herwin

PC 24HR Beaks

PC 91 Patrick

PC 137 Long

PC 234 Wing

PC 436 Hawke

PC 73 Mitchell

PC 246 Bird

PC H296 Winter (Times—Aug 30th 1886)

PC 364 Dixon

PC 36HR Chapman

PC 49HR Layton

PC 284 Lamerton

PC 362 Davis

PC H117 Brown (Times—Sep 16th 1886)

PC 33HR Warren

PC 41HR Miles

PC 393 Hoare [emphasis mine]

PC 169 Boon

PC 70 Gregory

[Debra Arif]

Note that the short article in The Daily Mirror, 6 November 1933, says Hoare knew some of the victims. It doesn't claim that he knew all of them. Specifically it states "he knew some of the victims personally."

Chris

Note that I was initially posting about the the two papers that I cited but did not post the contents of, not the Daily Mirror. One version says "He knew all the murderer's victims personally" That is the Nottingham Evening Post - Saturday 04 November 1933
The other paper-Fri 22 May 1936, Western Times, Devon, says he "knew one of the Ripper's victims personally."
That is exactly how those two newspapers were worded and why I emphasised those two particular words in my original post. Thank you.

[Chris G.]

That's fine, Deb. I am just pointing out the difference in the claims. Indeed it appears that there are three different claims. Take your pick--

1) Hoare knew all the victims.

2) Hoare knew some of the victims.

3) Hoare knew one of the victims.

Once again we are left wondering whether it was Hoare who told the story differently or if the newspaper men got the story differently.

Chris

[Debra Arif]

It's a common enough problem that those of us who trawl and search the papers encounter all the time. The essence of the story is the same: he knew x amount of victims personally and worked on the murder investigation.The specifics in terms of number may be different but that doesn't lessen the interest of the story and interest in Hoare himself, for me.

[Debra Arif]

Very well done - will be interesting to see if there is any feedback:-)

Fingers crossed.

[Howard Brown]

Debs:

I just took a gander at the British Library for anything on Hoare.....it looks like a major task, for sure.