Reid Challenges Anderson 1910

[Howard Brown]

Regarding Reid's opinion on whether Frances Coles was a Ripper victim :


Kilkenny Moderator
October 15, 1913
**************

[Trevor Marriott]

Regarding Reid's opinion on whether Frances Coles was a Ripper victim :


Kilkenny Moderator
October 15, 1913
**************

Thank you posting this


I see no evidence of a man with a failing memory in this interview, which took place 7 years after the News of the World article which was published in 1896.

https://www.trevormarriott.co.uk

[Paul]

It's interesting that Reid claims to have a bible, pawn tickets and a rent book belonging to Annie Chapman.

[Paul]

Thank you posting this

I see no evidence of a man with a failing memory in this interview, which took place 7 years after the News of the World article which was published in 1896.

www.trevormarriott.co.uk

Who is it who is saying that Reid had a failing memory?

[Trevor Marriott]

Who is it who is saying that Reid had a failing memory?

Since I made mention of the NOW article some time ago in which he states that no organs were missing or taken away by the killer of Kelly, in an attempt to pour cold water on this very important issue, some researchers have tried to negate this important revelation by stating that Reid was mistaken and that in 1896 when he gave that NOW interview his memory was failing.

Clearly his memory was as sharp as a needle in 1896 as it was in 1913. This latest report also shows that he kept "souvenirs" and no doubt his own case records to use as an aide de memoir.

www.trevormarriott.co.uk

[Chris Phillips]

Since I made mention of the NOW article some time ago in which he states that no organs were missing or taken away by the killer of Kelly, in an attempt to pour cold water on this very important issue, some researchers have tried to negate this important revelation by stating that Reid was mistaken and that in 1896 when he gave that NOW interview his memory was failing.

It's been pointed out to you that this isn't a thread about Kelly. No one here but you seems interested in what Reid said about Kelly.


You need to stop misrepresenting what other people have said.

[Chris Phillips]

Regarding Reid's opinion on whether Frances Coles was a Ripper victim :


Kilkenny Moderator
October 15, 1913

Thanks - that's interesting. I can't see that in Connell and Evans, and actually in stating that Turner/Tabram was the first victim, it apparently contradicts their opinion that probably Reid's nine victims started with Smith and (as they quote him saying) ended with Coles.

For what it's worth, it does contain another obvious indication that not all Reid's statements about the murders are to be relied on. He is quoted as placing Sir Henry Smith among those who had claimed to know the identity of the murderer, whereas in his memoirs three years earlier Smith had said the opposite.

[Paul]

Since I made mention of the NOW article some time ago in which he states that no organs were missing or taken away by the killer of Kelly, in an attempt to pour cold water on this very important issue, some researchers have tried to negate this important revelation by stating that Reid was mistaken and that in 1896 when he gave that NOW interview his memory was failing.

Clearly his memory was as sharp as a needle in 1896 as it was in 1913. This latest report also shows that he kept "souvenirs" and no doubt his own case records to use as an aide de memoir.

www.trevormarriott.co.uk

Who are the researchers who have said Reid's memory was failing? I'm not trying to put you on the spot, just trying to establish who it is who said the things you say have been said. It's important that we can see who has said it and, more importantly, why.

[Paul]

Thanks - that's interesting. I can't see that in Connell and Evans, and actually in stating that Turner/Tabram was the first victim, it apparently contradicts their opinion that probably Reid's nine victims started with Smith and (as they quote him saying) ended with Coles.

For what it's worth, it does contain another obvious indication that not all Reid's statements about the murders are to be relied on. He is quoted as placing Sir Henry Smith among those who had claimed to know the identity of the murderer, whereas in his memoirs three years earlier Smith had said the opposite.

Chris, also, I wonder when Reid took the pawn tickets, rent book, and Bible from Hanbury Street? Reid was on leave when Annie Chapman was murdered. Do you know when he returned?

[John Malcolm]

I wonder when Reid took the pawn tickets, rent book, and Bible from Hanbury Street? Reid was on leave when Annie Chapman was murdered. Do you know when he returned?

Hi Paul. I only see "all belonged to the victim in Berners St." mentioned.

[Chris Phillips]

Who are the researchers who have said Reid's memory was failing? I'm not trying to put you on the spot, just trying to establish who it is who said the things you say have been said. It's important that we can see who has said it and, more importantly, why.

Well, I said "his latter-day recollections were at least as faulty as those of Anderson." Trevor interpreted that as a suggestion of "memory loss." But of course one doesn't have to be suffering from any kind of clinical condition to misremember things that happened more than 20 years ago. Nearly all the senior officers who reminisced about the Ripper case made mistakes in what they wrote about it.

[Paul]

Hi Paul. I only see "all belonged to the victim in Berners St." mentioned.

Hi John,

“By the way, here are some pawn tickets, a rent book, and a Bible, which all belonged to the victim in Berners Street, I found them at her lodgings.” (The emphasis is mine).


I suppose Reid could have found them on his return from leave, but I'm not sure when that was. I would have thought, though, that as soon as she was identified the police would have searched her 'lodgings' and taken away any possessions.

[Paul]

Well, I said "his latter-day recollections were at least as faulty as those of Anderson." Trevor interpreted that as a suggestion of "memory loss." But of course one doesn't have to be suffering from any kind of clinical condition to misremember things that happened more than 20 years ago. Nearly all the senior officers who reminisced about the Ripper case made mistakes in what they wrote about it.

Ah. I'm sorry, I didn't realise Trevor was referring to you, but meant that someone had actually said Reid was suffering from memory loss.

[Gary Barnett]

Didn’t Dew say something about Fanny Mortimer standing by her garden gate?

Being a bit hazy about details or pretending you personally witnessed something when you didn’t is par for the course in memoirs, but I find it amazing that the man who dragged PP all over London looking for her soldiers could later claim that none of the nine were seen in the company of men. That’s a major memory lapse. Unless he didn’t believe her or he didn’t include Tabram in the nine.

[Paul]

Didn’t Dew say something about Fanny Mortimer standing by her garden gate?

Being a bit hazy about details or pretending you personally witnessed something when you didn’t is par for the course in memoirs, but I find it amazing that the man who dragged PP all over London looking for her soldiers could later claim that none of the nine were seen in the company of men. That’s a major memory lapse. Unless he didn’t believe her or he didn’t include Tabram in the nine.

Hi Gary, I don't know where Dew said anything about Fanny at the garden gate (sounds like the title of a music hall song!), butin I Caught Crippen he did say she stood at her 'gate' and then returned inside her 'cottage', which does perhaps give the impression of something nicer than Berner Street was.


I, of course, made a mistake earlier. Reid took the stuff belonging to Stride, not Chapman. I was writing something about Chapman and the name stuff in my mind. Memory loss, I suppose.