Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Jack the Ripper : The Macnaghten Memoranda

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #46
    ‘Scotland Yard can boast that not even the subordinate officers of the department will tell tales out of school, and it would ill become me to violate the unwritten rule of the service… I am almost tempted to disclose the identity of the murderer… But no public benefit would result from such a course, and the traditions of my old department would suffer.’

    I have previously urged folk not to view the Macnaghten Memo in some kind of splendid isolation, which I think we do here.
    If one takes into account Anderson's later comment, it becomes overwhelmingly clear that by revealing the identity of the murderer this would somehow have reflected badly on the Metropolitan Police Force of London, and in particular on the Executive Branch of that police force.
    There can only be one reason for that highly peculiar statement, that being the murderer was somehow connected to Anderson's department.

    Comment


    • #47
      Originally posted by Robert Linford View Post
      Stewart, just a quick question : do you know of a Sir Edward Blackall of Scotland Yard? He was mentioned by Cutbush in Broadmoor, but I think he meant Sir Edward Bradford.
      No, I should think that you are right about it being Bradford who was Commissioner from 1890-1903.

      Comment


      • #48
        Thanks Stewart.

        Comment


        • #49
          Originally posted by A.P. Wolf View Post
          ‘Scotland Yard can boast that not even the subordinate officers of the department will tell tales out of school, and it would ill become me to violate the unwritten rule of the service… I am almost tempted to disclose the identity of the murderer… But no public benefit would result from such a course, and the traditions of my old department would suffer.’

          I have previously urged folk not to view the Macnaghten Memo in some kind of splendid isolation, which I think we do here.
          If one takes into account Anderson's later comment, it becomes overwhelmingly clear that by revealing the identity of the murderer this would somehow have reflected badly on the Metropolitan Police Force of London, and in particular on the Executive Branch of that police force.
          There can only be one reason for that highly peculiar statement, that being the murderer was somehow connected to Anderson's department.
          Hello AP

          What an odd conclusion, AP. By contrast to your idea that "the murderer was somehow connected to Anderson's department", I take Macnaghten's statement at face value: that the tradition of the department was not to tell tales out of school. A dictum that it appears Fred Abberline and a lot of other officers connected to the Ripper investigation abided by. It's the type of "trust" or "honor code" that servants who worked for the Royal family similarly held to as well. That is, until fairly recent decades.

          Moreover, your notion that "the murderer was somehow connected to Anderson's department" is contradicted isn't it by Anderson's statement that the suspect (presumably meaning the leading suspect to have been the Ripper) was a Jew. So what connects that Jewish suspect to the CID?

          All the best

          Chris
          Christopher T. George, Lyricist & Co-Author, "Jack the Musical"
          https://www.facebook.com/JackTheMusical/ Hear sample song at https://tinyurl.com/y8h4envx.

          Organizer, RipperCon #JacktheRipper-#True Crime Conferences, April 2016 and 2018.
          Hear RipperCon 2016 & 2018 talks at http://www.casebook.org/podcast/.

          Comment


          • #50
            Fess up.

            If you are of a certain age, did you ever have a Pecos Kid/Lone Ranger set of cap guns, or perhaps one of those plastic daggers with a retractable spring-loaded blade with which you could make believe you'd stabbed someone?

            Why we would have wanted one is a matter for our psychiatrists.

            As a kid I had a set of these guns and one of these knives.

            And so, apparently, did Thomas Hayne Cutbush.

            Here is a letter written by Cutbush's solicitor—

            "In the case of Thomas Cutbush, Mr George Kirk of 1a Paternoster Row EC, his solicitor, writes April 16th as follows.

            "My attention has been brought to a report in the paper of yesterdays date of the case of Thomas Cutbush who was charged with maliciously wounding at the London County Session Newington sittings on the 14th instance.

            "In this it is stated that another scare was created by defendant stabbing a young female in Kennington with a toy dagger. As this is likely to create the impression that the defendant is guilty of the charges made against him I write to explain that I, the defendants solicitor, had a large number of witnesses present on defendant's behalf to establish his innocence and was advised by eminent counsel whom I had instructed to defend him that his acquittal was almost a matter of certainty. Owing however to the action of the Crown in raising the issue of insanity, first the case was not gone into although the defendant's friends were most anxious to have his innocence established. The circumstances are sufficiently painful to them without having it assumed and published that the defendant was guilty of the crimes imputed which there is good reason to believe he did not commit."

            PVC was discovered/invented in 1872, but I don't know if THC's "toy dagger" could have been made from such stuff.

            Perhaps his "toy dagger" was metallic. But how much injury could such a spring-loaded weapon have caused?

            Is this sad, pretend behaviour really the hallmark of JtR?

            Comment


            • #51
              Originally posted by Simon Wood View Post

              Is this sad, pretend behaviour really the hallmark of JtR?
              No. On the contrary.

              Chris
              Christopher T. George, Lyricist & Co-Author, "Jack the Musical"
              https://www.facebook.com/JackTheMusical/ Hear sample song at https://tinyurl.com/y8h4envx.

              Organizer, RipperCon #JacktheRipper-#True Crime Conferences, April 2016 and 2018.
              Hear RipperCon 2016 & 2018 talks at http://www.casebook.org/podcast/.

              Comment


              • #52
                Hi Chris,

                Please explain.

                Regards,

                Simon

                Comment


                • #53
                  Originally posted by Simon Wood View Post
                  Hi Chris,

                  Please explain.

                  Regards,

                  Simon
                  After doing the "extreme" murder-mutilations for which he is so famous, why would the Ripper need to play at being a killer?

                  Chris
                  Christopher T. George, Lyricist & Co-Author, "Jack the Musical"
                  https://www.facebook.com/JackTheMusical/ Hear sample song at https://tinyurl.com/y8h4envx.

                  Organizer, RipperCon #JacktheRipper-#True Crime Conferences, April 2016 and 2018.
                  Hear RipperCon 2016 & 2018 talks at http://www.casebook.org/podcast/.

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    According to the Lloyd's article, the knife was more formidable than a toy. However, there may well have been at least two knives - Macnaghten says one was bought in Feb 1891, while Mrs Dickinson says she sold one to Thomas in March. If you'll forgive the expression, we may never get to the bottom of these jobbings.

                    http://www.jtrforums.com/showthread.php?t=3772

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Originally posted by Robert Linford View Post
                      However, there may well have been at least two knives
                      ... job-lot?

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Yes Gareth, after which ladies' outfitters did a bustling trade.

                        But we're straying off the Memorandum, folks.

                        Come in Stewart.

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          The 'toy sword' was actually a seven star Chinese blade, one of the finest and most deadly weapons of the that age, forged and crafted by the most renowned master blade makers in China.
                          It was considered a 'toy' because the British Empire had suffered great humilation at its expense.

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Hi AP,

                            Please elaborate about THC's most deadly weapon.

                            Regards

                            Simon

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              'Is this sad, pretend behaviour really the hallmark of JtR?'

                              Yes it is, Simon.
                              You seem to forget that someone during this period was recklessly slaughtering women, cleaving them apart and throwing their bits around London, in the Thames, in Scotland Yard and many other locations around London. These crimes began before the Whitechapel Murders and continued long after.
                              It is not unreasonable to suggest or suppose that the person you know as JtR was merely pretending to murder women in a similar fashion.

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                I think I'm in perfect agreement with Race when he says that Chinese blades that had never seen China were commonplace in Whitechapel in 1888; but I'm afraid I am in perfect disagreement with him when it comes to Chinese blades which carry the seven star pattern, as in the blade carried by Cutbush.
                                To carry the seven stars it must have been a genuine export item.
                                Incidentally the seven star blade's symbolism was based upon the ancient Triad belief that it was the ultimate weapon for beheading demons; and is still the centre piece of any Triad altar in Soho's China Town.
                                Here is a fine example:
                                Attached Images

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X