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  • Voters list 1888?

    Ladies/Gents,

    Has anyone got any experience of using the 1888 voters list for London?

    Gordon.

  • #2
    Hi Gordon

    The records are available on Ancestry (roughly 350 000 names).

    Comment


    • #3
      Good luck with that, Gordon.

      Not that I think JTR was a civic-minded fella....but his name may be in there.

      Look in the local reprobate section...start with the surname Linford....there's gotta be some juicy characters in that list.
      To Join JTR Forums :
      Contact Howard@jtrforums.com

      Comment


      • #4
        Voters 1888

        Hi Guys,

        Basically I'm trying to trace a police officer who I know was in J Division at the time of the Whitechapel murders. I wondered whether voters might give me an address that might give me an idea which station he was based at. I also thought of the census, but he only served there between 1888 and 1890, so missed the census as it were.

        From your experience, could voters hold the key?

        Gordon.

        Comment


        • #5
          Gordon:
          If Robert or Debs don't find him first, I'll ask Nina to take a look. She's good at this sort of thing.
          To Join JTR Forums :
          Contact Howard@jtrforums.com

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          • #6
            Hi Gordon

            If you want to give a name, I'll have a look. I doubt if address would enable you to pinpoint the station - you'd need a police researcher like Monty to do that.

            Comment


            • #7
              Cheers guys, if you could have a look for me that would be great!!!


              His details are, Police Constable Joseph Daniels Metropolitan Police, 10th August 1888, posted to J Div PC 223/PC 502 (Bethnal Green), until the 15th August 1890. I believe he would have been married to his wife Louisa, by then.

              Comment


              • #8
                Hi Gordon

                OK, this is extremely rough-and-ready and there's plenty of room for me to have cocked it up. In addition, we don't know if he was even registered. It doesn't help that Louisa seems not to be registered. Some women were, but not this one.

                I found what I believe were Joseph and Louisa in the 1891 census in Southwark.

                I looked at the electoral entries for a Joseph Daniels for the relevant period, and then tried to eliminate them using the 1891 electorals, and the 81 and 91 censuses.

                I seem to be left with only one possibility, and that is 107 Lefevre Rd, Bow. I tried using Lefevre Rd on address search Find My Past for 1891 but it wouldn't come up. I clicked through the list of Joseph Daniels for 1891 but didn't see any one of them living there. I did find 107 Lefevre in 1881 but no Joseph Daniels there at that time.

                As I say, this is very rough-and-ready and Debs or Nina might have better luck.

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                • #9
                  Women did not receive the vote until 1919 so there would not be any women on the list.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    True as far as parliamentary elections go, Phillip, (1918 actually) but not all elections were parliamentary.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Robert Linford View Post
                      Hi Gordon

                      OK, this is extremely rough-and-ready and there's plenty of room for me to have cocked it up. In addition, we don't know if he was even registered. It doesn't help that Louisa seems not to be registered. Some women were, but not this one.

                      I found what I believe were Joseph and Louisa in the 1891 census in Southwark.

                      I looked at the electoral entries for a Joseph Daniels for the relevant period, and then tried to eliminate them using the 1891 electorals, and the 81 and 91 censuses.

                      I seem to be left with only one possibility, and that is 107 Lefevre Rd, Bow. I tried using Lefevre Rd on address search Find My Past for 1891 but it wouldn't come up. I clicked through the list of Joseph Daniels for 1891 but didn't see any one of them living there. I did find 107 Lefevre in 1881 but no Joseph Daniels there at that time.

                      As I say, this is very rough-and-ready and Debs or Nina might have better luck.


                      Hi Robert,

                      Many thanks indeed for taking the time to do this digging for me. I did consider the fact that perhaps bobbies weren't allowed to vote in those days (I knew women weren't). But as he's on the voters list they must have been able to. Something else that's just occurred to me, is that I know he died in 1892 and was 27, which would mean he was on 16 in 1881 so unlikely to have been registered then? The key date for me is the 1888 to 1890 period as that's when he was with J Division. I am hoping to be able to locate an address near Bethnal Green area which will firm up a bit whether he may have been involved (albeit indirectly) with follow up Ripper enquires/patrols etc. I know he was in C Division in 1886 and E Division in 1890, which firms up the Bow Street address, you've found. Interestingly in the newspaper report of his death (on duty), it states...

                      "Joseph Daniels a registration agent of 9 Meeting House Lane, Peckham. Identified the deceased as his son, lately resided at Jubilee Buildings, Waterloo Road." Jubilee Buildings appears to no longer exist? But Waterloo Road, is very near to Southwark, so you appear to be bob on there!

                      I assume his father was also called Daniel? Now is the Jubilee Buildings address "lately resided" for father or son?

                      107 Lefevre Rd, Bow appears to no longer exist, but I have found a 107 Lefevre Walk, Bow, wonder if there one and the same? Sadly all the period buildings are long since gone (google maps).

                      Gordon.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        You're welcome, Gordon.

                        The Lefevre address was Bow, not Bow St. Bow isn't far from Bethnal Green.

                        Yes, he wasn't registered in 1881 but I used that census to eliminate one or two possibilities.

                        Lately resided refers to the deceased son.

                        This site mentions Lefevre Rd :

                        http://www.victimsvoice.co.uk/usher/...a_07012012.pdf


                        I looked for baptisms to see if I could get an address from that but the only one I could get was for his daughter Florence, who was born too soon. However one thing that would give you a very good chance of finding his address, would be if you ordered the birth certificate of his first son Albert Henry Joseph Daniels, born December 1888 but registered first quarter 1889, Bethnal Green. This would hopefully give a home address.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Robert Linford View Post
                          You're welcome, Gordon.

                          The Lefevre address was Bow, not Bow St. Bow isn't far from Bethnal Green.

                          Yes, he wasn't registered in 1881 but I used that census to eliminate one or two possibilities.

                          Lately resided refers to the deceased son.

                          This site mentions Lefevre Rd :

                          http://www.victimsvoice.co.uk/usher/...a_07012012.pdf


                          I looked for baptisms to see if I could get an address from that but the only one I could get was for his daughter Florence, who was born too soon. However one thing that would give you a very good chance of finding his address, would be if you ordered the birth certificate of his first son Albert Henry Joseph Daniels, born December 1888 but registered first quarter 1889, Bethnal Green. This would hopefully give a home address.




                          Hi Robert,

                          This is brilliant the evidence is coming together almost perfectly. Assuming I'm putting the facts together correctly and we've got the right Joseph Daniels that is, but this seems to be the case. Further and putting aside my getting Bow and Bow Street mixed up. Jubilee Buildings would appear to be were he lived with his family in 1892. Which is in or near to Southwark, Waterloo Road is certainly within walking distance to Bow Street the HQ of E Division and I know he died taking a prisoner there so I assume he was based at Bow Street station during his time with E Division. Now we know he was living at 107 Lefevre Rd, Bow in 1891 (assume he used the tube to commute between here and Bow Street for a few months whilst he waited for somewhere to move his family nearer, which transpired to be Jubilee Buildings, or perhaps he moved to the station house and his family remained at 107, until they moved to Waterloo Road). We also know that he wasn't living at 107 Lefevre Rd, Bow in 1881. We also know that he joined the Met in 1886 and started his service in C Division (whether he was living at 107 when he joined is another avenue- was he married then? Perhaps he was living in the station house then. He got married between 1886 & 1888 and moved to 107 and asked for post to nearer, or was posted to J Division as a result of getting married). So assuming 107 was the martial home and hence the reason for his posting from C to J, as you say it's not very far from Bethnal Green. Now Lefevre Street, appears to have been along Roman Road somewhere certainly within easy walking distance of Bethnal Green police station. We also now that his daughter was registered in 1889 in Bethnal Green (assume this being the place itself and not the name for the whole distract like the Divisional name suggests). This further adds the possibility to the fact that he more than likely was stationed at Bethnal Green nick. Hackney,Homerton & Dalston are also within tube distance of 107 via Bethnal Green, but surely if he was stationed in anyone of those nicks, he'd have found a home nearer to whichever one (but there could be any number of reasons for that, cost availability of lodgings, that's were they required him, etc - perhaps he was stationed further into the division, but this seems unlikely). No I think (but I am bias) that he was stationed in Bethnal Green. Was he on duty the night Polly Nichols was killed, on another beat perhaps, who knows? Was he involved in any follow up enquires or patrols, almost certainly. Did he know the other officers who found Nichols, almost certainly. He would also have known the crime scene, perhaps he patrolled it during another beat rotation?

                          I am more than happy with this evidence, unless anyone can find any caveats in our evidence?

                          Thanks you ever for much Robert, for all your help!!!!!

                          Gordon.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Hi Gordon

                            We don't actually know that he was living at 107 Lefevre, that's just my best guess. Also he would be living there 1888 - 1890, not 1891.

                            It was his son Albert who was registered 1889.

                            He may have had a marital home or a martial home - depends if it was a happy marriage.

                            I will PM you.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Hi Gordon

                              Re the marriage, Joseph married Louisa Beatrice Ridley second quarter 1885, at Camberwell.

                              Bethnal Green was a registration district. Hopefully this link will work :

                              http://www.ukbmd.org.uk/genuki/reg/d...l%20green.html

                              Re Florence, I do not have an original image for the baptism but the index record reads :

                              Name: Florence Ellen Daniels Gender: Female Birth Date: 5 Dec 1886 Birth Place: Saint Peter-great Windmill St , Westminster, London, England Baptism Date: 20 Apr 1887 Baptism Place: St Peter's, Westminster, Middlesex, England Father: Joseph Daniels Mother: Louisa Beatrice FHL Film Number: 1468962

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